Australian Politics Forum - abos arent a race

MeisterEckhart

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #75 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 2:53pm

Belgarion wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 2:50pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 2:47pm:

The Sentinel Islands people are an excellent example of people having an African appearance but genetically more closely related to peoples of East Asia than Africa.

How do they know? No one survives contact Wink

Anyone can survive contact if they choose to shoot them, but many non-fatal contacts were made prior to the islands being protected from contact.

The Indian government made multiple contacts with the Sentinelese people.

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freediver

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #76 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 2:59pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 2:47pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:52pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:34pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:26pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:19pm:

It has only been a few decades - with the mapping of the human genome - and the popularity of DNA ancestry, that the notion of race has been debunked as meaningless except as a reference to cultural/social/religious differences.

I watched a video of someone who thought he was 'pure' Han Chinese - until he received his DNA analysis results. Turns out he was likely 10% Korean.

He was not happy! Or 不开心 .

If DNA has debunked the existence of race, how is it possible to use DNA to identify a person's racial ancestry?

Also, did you know that there are significant amounts of human DNA that are only present in people originating from outside of Africa?

DNA analysis places ancestors geographically, not racially.

Another slight of hand. What is race, other than geographic origin?

Race is a term that means whatever the writer/speaker says it means, although usually the writer/speaker is referring to physical features

Prior to the discovery of DNA and its decoding, all notion of race was determined by physical features.

The Sentinel Islands people are an excellent example of people having an African appearance but genetically more closely related to peoples of East Asia than Africa.

So prior to the discovery of DNA, people would not have understood what you meant if you described your race as east Asian, European, African, Maori, Native American etc? And people only made the link between race and geography because they were lead down that path by DNA evidence?

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #77 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:04pm

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 2:59pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 2:47pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:52pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:34pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:26pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:19pm:

It has only been a few decades - with the mapping of the human genome - and the popularity of DNA ancestry, that the notion of race has been debunked as meaningless except as a reference to cultural/social/religious differences.

I watched a video of someone who thought he was 'pure' Han Chinese - until he received his DNA analysis results. Turns out he was likely 10% Korean.

He was not happy! Or 不开心 .

If DNA has debunked the existence of race, how is it possible to use DNA to identify a person's racial ancestry?

Also, did you know that there are significant amounts of human DNA that are only present in people originating from outside of Africa?

DNA analysis places ancestors geographically, not racially.

Another slight of hand. What is race, other than geographic origin?

Race is a term that means whatever the writer/speaker says it means, although usually the writer/speaker is referring to physical features

Prior to the discovery of DNA and its decoding, all notion of race was determined by physical features.

The Sentinel Islands people are an excellent example of people having an African appearance but genetically more closely related to peoples of East Asia than Africa.

So prior to the discovery of DNA, people would not have understood what you meant if you described your race as east Asian, European, African, Maori, Native American etc?

None of those peoples would have defined themselves by 'race' or those regions.

They would have described themselves in terms of tribal affiliations and/or socio-cultural status. 'Maori', for example, means 'ordinary person' and has no reference to 'race' - which did not exist as a concept.

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Brian Ross

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #78 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:08pm

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:57pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:49pm:

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:45pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:44pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:26pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:19pm:

It has only been a few decades - with the mapping of the human genome - and the popularity of DNA ancestry, that the notion of race has been debunked as meaningless except as a reference to cultural/social/religious differences.

I watched a video of someone who thought he was 'pure' Han Chinese - until he received his DNA analysis results. Turns out he was likely 10% Korean.

He was not happy! Or 不开心 .

If DNA has debunked the existence of race, how is it possible to use DNA to identify a person's racial ancestry?

Through their ancestry. There is no reliable way for Genetics to determine a person's "Race" except through their ancestral origins (ie, they come from Africa therefore they must be African). It is a piece of DNA slight-of-hand which fools most people. It is discovered only by digging and questioning the results when they are presented.

So clearly Abos aren't a race ............. easy as pie.... ergo - no racism against them...

Tell that to the Racists who do denigrate and mistreat them at every step. Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

That's not denigration and mistreatment - that's criticising them for their own wrongdoings... which they are not man enough to own up to...

Tell you what, how about I criticise you for your, "own wrongdoings," then, old man? Hey? If that isn't criticising a person what is it? No excuses, please, just tell us the truth for a change? Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

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Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour. Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe? Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

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Brian Ross

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #79 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:09pm

Frank wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 2:24pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:44pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:26pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:19pm:

It has only been a few decades - with the mapping of the human genome - and the popularity of DNA ancestry, that the notion of race has been debunked as meaningless except as a reference to cultural/social/religious differences.

I watched a video of someone who thought he was 'pure' Han Chinese - until he received his DNA analysis results. Turns out he was likely 10% Korean.

He was not happy! Or 不开心 .

If DNA has debunked the existence of race, how is it possible to use DNA to identify a person's racial ancestry?

Through their ancestry. There is no reliable way for Genetics to determine a person's "Race" except through their ancestral origins (ie, they come from Africa therefore they must be African). It is a piece of DNA slight-of-hand which fools most people. It is discovered only by digging and questioning the results when they are presented.

What is the difference between race and ancestral origins?

The difference between blacks and whites is their ancestral origins - one has white ancestors the other black ones.

It's not random, you know.

It is the attitude of the criticiser, Soren. Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

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Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour. Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe? Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

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freediver

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #80 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:10pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:04pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 2:59pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 2:47pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:52pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:34pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:26pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:19pm:

It has only been a few decades - with the mapping of the human genome - and the popularity of DNA ancestry, that the notion of race has been debunked as meaningless except as a reference to cultural/social/religious differences.

I watched a video of someone who thought he was 'pure' Han Chinese - until he received his DNA analysis results. Turns out he was likely 10% Korean.

He was not happy! Or 不开心 .

If DNA has debunked the existence of race, how is it possible to use DNA to identify a person's racial ancestry?

Also, did you know that there are significant amounts of human DNA that are only present in people originating from outside of Africa?

DNA analysis places ancestors geographically, not racially.

Another slight of hand. What is race, other than geographic origin?

Race is a term that means whatever the writer/speaker says it means, although usually the writer/speaker is referring to physical features

Prior to the discovery of DNA and its decoding, all notion of race was determined by physical features.

The Sentinel Islands people are an excellent example of people having an African appearance but genetically more closely related to peoples of East Asia than Africa.

So prior to the discovery of DNA, people would not have understood what you meant if you described your race as east Asian, European, African, Maori, Native American etc?

None of those peoples would have defined themselves by 'race' or those regions.

They would have described themselves in terms of tribal affiliations and/or socio-cultural status. 'Maori', for example, means 'ordinary person' and has no reference to 'race' - which did not exist as a concept.

So you think the concept of race did not even exist prior to the discovery of DNA? But also that DNA 'debunked' the concept of race?

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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Bobby. Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 103415 Melbourne Gender:	Re: abos arent a race Reply #81 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:11pm The Abbos are of the Indian race - they even look like Indians.
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Frank

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #82 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:11pm

Brian Ross wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:09pm:

Frank wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 2:24pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:44pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:26pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:19pm:

It has only been a few decades - with the mapping of the human genome - and the popularity of DNA ancestry, that the notion of race has been debunked as meaningless except as a reference to cultural/social/religious differences.

I watched a video of someone who thought he was 'pure' Han Chinese - until he received his DNA analysis results. Turns out he was likely 10% Korean.

He was not happy! Or 不开心 .

If DNA has debunked the existence of race, how is it possible to use DNA to identify a person's racial ancestry?

Through their ancestry. There is no reliable way for Genetics to determine a person's "Race" except through their ancestral origins (ie, they come from Africa therefore they must be African). It is a piece of DNA slight-of-hand which fools most people. It is discovered only by digging and questioning the results when they are presented.

What is the difference between race and ancestral origins?

The difference between blacks and whites is their ancestral origins - one has white ancestors the other black ones.

It's not random, you know.

It is the attitude of the criticiser, Soren. Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

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Estragon: I can’t go on like this.
Vladimir: That’s what you think.

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #83 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:18pm

Bobby. wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:11pm:

The Abbos are of the Indian race -

they even look like Indians.

The Indian 'race', eh?

Which Indians? Peoples of the Indian sub-continent are the most diverse people in the world in all senses of the word - hence Modi's obsession with Indian nationalism: building on the myth of one Indic people.

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Brian Ross

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #84 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:18pm

I'll ask it again, shall I?

Brian Ross wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:08pm:

Here is a question: What is your motivation behind this thread? Is it to denigrate people because of their claims to be Indigenous or is it just to stir things amongst people because it gives you pleasure to do so?

I suspect it is the latter rather than the former. You don't care how scientifically wrong you are. Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

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Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour. Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe? Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

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Bobby.

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #85 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:21pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:18pm:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:11pm:

The Abbos are of the Indian race -

they even look like Indians.

The Indian 'race', eh?

Which Indians? Peoples of the Indian sub-continent are the most diverse people in the world in all senses of the word - hence Modi's obsession with Indian nationalism: building on the myth of one Indic people.

The Abbos are related to the Southern Indians - the really dark ones.

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #86 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:22pm

Bobby. wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:21pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:18pm:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:11pm:

The Abbos are of the Indian race -

they even look like Indians.

The Indian 'race', eh?

Which Indians? Peoples of the Indian sub-continent are the most diverse people in the world in all senses of the word - hence Modi's obsession with Indian nationalism: building on the myth of one Indic people.

The Abbos are related to the Southern Indians - the really dark ones.

Southern Indians, eh! Which ones?

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Bobby.

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #87 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:26pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:22pm:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:21pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:18pm:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:11pm:

The Abbos are of the Indian race -

they even look like Indians.

The Indian 'race', eh?

Which Indians? Peoples of the Indian sub-continent are the most diverse people in the world in all senses of the word - hence Modi's obsession with Indian nationalism: building on the myth of one Indic people.

The Abbos are related to the Southern Indians - the really dark ones.

Southern Indians, eh! Which ones?

Who cares -
the fact remains -
the Abbos are basically Indians.

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #88 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:30pm

Bobby. wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:26pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:22pm:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:21pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:18pm:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:11pm:

The Abbos are of the Indian race -

they even look like Indians.

The Indian 'race', eh?

Which Indians? Peoples of the Indian sub-continent are the most diverse people in the world in all senses of the word - hence Modi's obsession with Indian nationalism: building on the myth of one Indic people.

The Abbos are related to the Southern Indians - the really dark ones.

Southern Indians, eh! Which ones?

Who cares -
the fact remains -
the Abbos are basically Indians.

Certain DNA was inherited by certain peoples of the Indian subcontinent and by those who became Australian Aboriginals - they are both related to east-migrating hunter-gatherer sapiens over 60,000 years ago - not directly to each other.

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Bobby.

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #89 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:38pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:30pm:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:26pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:22pm:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:21pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:18pm:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:11pm:

The Abbos are of the Indian race -

they even look like Indians.

The Indian 'race', eh?

Which Indians? Peoples of the Indian sub-continent are the most diverse people in the world in all senses of the word - hence Modi's obsession with Indian nationalism: building on the myth of one Indic people.

The Abbos are related to the Southern Indians - the really dark ones.

Southern Indians, eh! Which ones?

Who cares -
the fact remains -
the Abbos are basically Indians.

Certain DNA was inherited by certain peoples of the Indian subcontinent and by those who became Australian Aboriginals - they are both related to west-migrating hunter-gatherer sapiens over 60,000 years ago - not directly to each other.

The last glacial period began about 100,000 years ago and lasted until 25,000 years ago.
The sea levels were much lower.
At that time there was a land bridge from South East Asia all the way to Australia.
The Southern Indians migrated here along that route over 1,000s of years.
The interbred a little on the way.
They also evolved to survive the harsh, dry Australian conditions
but still - they are basically just primitive Indians who migrated here
about 60,000 years ago.
When we look at Abbos we can see what our ancestors looked like
60,000 years ago before we evolved into more complex beings capable
of modern civilisation - with buildings, cities and technology.

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