Australian Politics Forum - Does Atheism really exist?

Sir Spot of Borg Gold Member Offline WE ARE BORG Posts: 26506 Australia	Re: Does Atheism really exist? Reply #15 - Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 10:54am Isnt atheism just a lack of belief? In which case it has always and will always exist. Its theism that may not always exist. Spot
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Frank Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 45351 Gender:	Re: Does Atheism really exist? Reply #16 - Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 11:16am Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 10:54am: Isnt atheism just a lack of belief? In which case it has always and will always exist. Its theism that may not always exist. Spot It is a belief, just not in a theos.
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Jovial Monk

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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #17 - Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 6:40pm

It is a belief because no one has shown a shred of evidence that Gawd or gods exist.

It probably isn’t a belief like religious faith is a belief, just a realisation that there is no evidence AT ALL that gods exist. But there is absolutely no evidence for or against a supernatural daddy.

Atheism is not a movement or anything like that. It is something someone just realises is the only possible intellectual position.

Sure, after thinking about all this the evils of religion—and not just in the past “praying to convert {someone} from homosexuality” causes immense psychological harm. Believing in something that doesn’t exist and trying to force the world to fit whatever belief in the impossible you hold is going to cause friction no matter what!

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« Last Edit: Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 6:47pm by Jovial Monk »

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Jasin

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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #18 - Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 7:06pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 6:40pm:

It is a belief because no one has shown a shred of evidence that Gawd or gods exist.

It probably isn’t a belief like religious faith is a belief, just a realisation that there is no evidence AT ALL that gods exist. But there is absolutely no evidence for or against a supernatural daddy.

Atheism is not a movement or anything like that. It is something someone just realises is the only possible intellectual position.

Sure, after thinking about all this the evils of religion—and not just in the past “praying to convert {someone} from homosexuality” causes immense psychological harm. Believing in something that doesn’t exist and trying to force the world to fit whatever belief in the impossible you hold is going to cause friction no matter what!

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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.

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Frank

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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #19 - Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 9:39pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 6:40pm:

It is a belief because no one has shown a shred of evidence that Gawd or gods exist.

It probably isn’t a belief like religious faith is a belief, just a realisation that there is no evidence AT ALL that gods exist. But there is absolutely no evidence for or against a supernatural daddy.

Atheism is not a movement or anything like that. It is something someone just realises is the only possible intellectual position.

Sure, after thinking about all this the evils of religion—and not just in the past “praying to convert {someone} from homosexuality” causes immense psychological harm. Believing in something that doesn’t exist and trying to force the world to fit whatever belief in the impossible you hold is going to cause friction no matter what!

Well, there have been many, many people who testified to their own encounter with god.
Atheism is a belief, of course, because what it responds to is also a belief.

God doesn't need to be supernatural.

Many people take the amazing rationality of nature - the basis of science - as an evidence of a rational created. No million monkeys on keyboards could have come up with life, DNA, the galaxies.

God doesn't need to be like you, in fact can't be like you - finite, material, dying. Yes, it is impossible for finite, material, dying creatures to conceive of something that isn't like tha, but that doesnt prove anything.

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« Last Edit: Sep 24^th, 2023 at 10:50am by Frank »

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Lisa Jones

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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #20 - Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 9:43pm

Frank wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 10:30am:

Linus wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2023 at 9:27pm:

And you, Frank, are you a Theist?

Well, I used to be an atheist but I grew out of it. I am a sympathetic, cultural Christian but philosophically a Spinozist.

Religion is very significant culturally, historically, in art, literature, philosophy, psychology etc and I am not prepared do discount or discard that significance. My conception of religion and God is closest to Spinoza's. That doesn't make me an Einstein but does put me in the same group as Albert.

1. What’s a cultural Christian?

2. Are you a Catholic or a Protestant?

Edit : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_Christians#:~:text=Cultural%20Christians%...

👆 Well...that didn’t help. My 2 questions still remain.

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« Last Edit: Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 9:53pm by Lisa Jones »

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Jovial Monk

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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #21 - Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 9:53pm

Frank wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 9:39pm:

Jovial Monk wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 6:40pm:

It is a belief because no one has shown a shred of evidence that Gawd or gods exist.

It probably isn’t a belief like religious faith is a belief, just a realisation that there is no evidence AT ALL that gods exist. But there is absolutely no evidence for or against a supernatural daddy.

Atheism is not a movement or anything like that. It is something someone just realises is the only possible intellectual position.

Sure, after thinking about all this the evils of religion—and not just in the past “praying to convert {someone} from homosexuality” causes immense psychological harm. Believing in something that doesn’t exist and trying to force the world to fit whatever belief in the impossible you hold is going to cause friction no matter what!

Well, there have been many, mmm any people who testified to their own encounter with god.
Atheism is a belief, of course, because what it responds to is also a belief.

God doesn't need to be supernatural.

Many people take the amazing rationality of nature - the basis of science - as an evidence of a rational created. No million monkeys on keyboards could have come up with life, DNA, the galaxies.

God doesn't need to be like you, in fact can't be like you - finite, material, dying. Yes, it is impossible for finite, material, dying creatures to conceive of something that isn't like tha, but that doesnt prove anything.

Quote:

[M]any people who testified to their own encounter with god.

But these mental cases had nothing OBJECTIVE re Gawd, right?

Quote:

God doesn't need to be supernatural.

So I could talk to him? Nah!

Quote:

God doesn't need to be like you, in fact can't be like you - finite, material, dying. Yes, it is impossible for finite, material, dying creatures to conceive of something that isn't like tha, but that doesnt prove anything.

So much for Gawd not being supernatural!

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Lisa Jones

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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #22 - Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 9:55pm

Jasin wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 7:06pm:

Jovial Monk wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 6:40pm:

It is a belief because no one has shown a shred of evidence that Gawd or gods exist.

It probably isn’t a belief like religious faith is a belief, just a realisation that there is no evidence AT ALL that gods exist. But there is absolutely no evidence for or against a supernatural daddy.

Atheism is not a movement or anything like that. It is something someone just realises is the only possible intellectual position.

Sure, after thinking about all this the evils of religion—and not just in the past “praying to convert {someone} from homosexuality” causes immense psychological harm. Believing in something that doesn’t exist and trying to force the world to fit whatever belief in the impossible you hold is going to cause friction no matter what!

I just post over the demented 80 yr old drunk.

But your method is also quite good I must say Jasin.

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If I let myself be bought then I am no longer free.

HYPATIA - Greek philosopher, mathematician and astronomer (370 - 415)

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Jovial Monk

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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #23 - Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 10:13pm

Lisa Jones wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 9:55pm:

Jasin wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 7:06pm:

Jovial Monk wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 6:40pm:

It is a belief because no one has shown a shred of evidence that Gawd or gods exist.

It probably isn’t a belief like religious faith is a belief, just a realisation that there is no evidence AT ALL that gods exist. But there is absolutely no evidence for or against a supernatural daddy.

Atheism is not a movement or anything like that. It is something someone just realises is the only possible intellectual position.

Sure, after thinking about all this the evils of religion—and not just in the past “praying to convert {someone} from homosexuality” causes immense psychological harm. Believing in something that doesn’t exist and trying to force the world to fit whatever belief in the impossible you hold is going to cause friction no matter what!

I just post over the demented 80 yr old drunk.

But your method is also quite good I must say Jasin.

Neither requires any brain power or even simple thought so of course it appeals to you two idiots!

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Lisa Jones

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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #24 - Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 10:45pm

Lisa Jones wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 9:55pm:

Jasin wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 7:06pm:

Jovial Monk wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 6:40pm:

It is a belief because no one has shown a shred of evidence that Gawd or gods exist.

It probably isn’t a belief like religious faith is a belief, just a realisation that there is no evidence AT ALL that gods exist. But there is absolutely no evidence for or against a supernatural daddy.

Atheism is not a movement or anything like that. It is something someone just realises is the only possible intellectual position.

Sure, after thinking about all this the evils of religion—and not just in the past “praying to convert {someone} from homosexuality” causes immense psychological harm. Believing in something that doesn’t exist and trying to force the world to fit whatever belief in the impossible you hold is going to cause friction no matter what!

I just post over the demented 80 yr old drunk.

But your method is also quite good I must say Jasin.

In fact I think I might try it 😂🤣😆

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If I let myself be bought then I am no longer free.

HYPATIA - Greek philosopher, mathematician and astronomer (370 - 415)

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Bobby.

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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #25 - Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 11:00pm

Lisa Jones wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 10:45pm:

Lisa Jones wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 9:55pm:

Jasin wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 7:06pm:

Jovial Monk wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 6:40pm:

It is a belief because no one has shown a shred of evidence that Gawd or gods exist.

It probably isn’t a belief like religious faith is a belief, just a realisation that there is no evidence AT ALL that gods exist. But there is absolutely no evidence for or against a supernatural daddy.

Atheism is not a movement or anything like that. It is something someone just realises is the only possible intellectual position.

Sure, after thinking about all this the evils of religion—and not just in the past “praying to convert {someone} from homosexuality” causes immense psychological harm. Believing in something that doesn’t exist and trying to force the world to fit whatever belief in the impossible you hold is going to cause friction no matter what!

I just post over the demented 80 yr old drunk.

But your method is also quite good I must say Jasin.

In fact I think I might try it 😂🤣😆

Leave the Godless heathens to themselves.

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Jovial Monk Gold Member Offline Dogs not cats! Posts: 46197 Gender:	Re: Does Atheism really exist? Reply #26 - Sep 23^rd, 2023 at 11:02pm Yes “Babe!”
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AusGeoff

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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #27 - Sep 24^th, 2023 at 2:28am

"Does Atheism really exist?"

Yes, of course it does; it's nothing more than a personal
state of mind like love, anguish, or fear.

I've described myself as an atheist for more than sixty
years now, and it's uniquely impossible for anybody else
to dispute that.

On the other hand, it's more than apparent that theism
exists; it has a book of instructions that must be followed,
it has buildings where its practitioners gather, it has wise
men who instruct them regularly, and it requires absolute
belief in the real-world existence of supernatural entities and
paranormal phenomena.

The decider is that there is no empirical evidence that
supports the existence of God or gods. QED.

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Frank

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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #28 - Sep 24^th, 2023 at 11:04am

AusGeoff wrote on Sep 24^th, 2023 at 2:28am:

"Does Atheism really exist?"

Yes, of course it does; it's nothing more than a personal
state of mind like love, anguish, or fear.

I've described myself as an atheist for more than sixty
years now, and it's uniquely impossible for anybody else
to dispute that.

On the other hand, it's more than apparent that theism
exists; it has a book of instructions that must be followed,
it has buildings where its practitioners gather, it has wise
men who instruct them regularly, and it requires absolute
belief in the real-world existence of supernatural entities and
paranormal phenomena.

The decider is that there is no empirical evidence that
supports the existence of God or gods. QED.

It is embarrassingly easy to point out that there is no empirical evidence of your atheist belief just as there is no empirical evidence of any other concepts, ideas, beliefs.

It is also too easy to point out that anything supernatural would not be accessible to natural, empirical experience.

Theism and your atheism are empirically experienced in their performance in speech and behaviour, which are accessible to empirical sense experience. Your beliefs aren't.

So your smug little QED is meaningless and you have shown nothing to resolve or conclude this centuries old debate.

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Jasin Gold Member Offline Posts: 47717 Gender:	Re: Does Atheism really exist? Reply #29 - Sep 24^th, 2023 at 11:45am You see Lisa. I can take both Geoff's and Franks (yours too) inputs with intelligent stimulation but Monk's I will not bother with - he doesn't really exist and we all know on this fine Forum that there is evidence for his non-existence here. He's just some hoax.
Back to top	AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY. IP Logged

Poll
Question: Atheism - how do YOU define it?
Not believing in GOD? 6 (50.0%) Believing in NO GOD? 6 (50.0%) Total votes: 12 « Created by: Lisa Jones on: Sep 28^th, 2023 at 11:29am »