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Question: Atheism - how do YOU define it?

Not believing in GOD?    
  6 (50.0%)
Believing in NO GOD?    
  6 (50.0%)




Total votes: 12
« Created by: Lisa Jones on: Sep 28th, 2023 at 11:29am »

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Does Atheism really exist? (Read 36126 times)
Frank
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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #480 - Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:22pm
 
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:02pm:
Frank wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 8:53pm:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 8:14pm:
Frank wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 7:57pm:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 7:55pm:
So, which theism do you speak of?

Mosesism - the long-bearded father in the sky, who watches our every move?

The universe - a nebulous benevolent spiritual force - the god of the affluent - that considers and responds to supplications that humans throw out to it?

Or something else.



Well, which theism does atheism not negate? Any?

My understanding is, 'all.
(Except primitive 'spiritualism' )

Which theism does atheism not negate?

Except 'primitive spiritualism'?

So 'atheism' does come in different flavours, then.

Yes, like all ideological reaction, it's selective.

So, not all 'atheisms' are the same, then - like not all fish that swim in the same river are the same species.

They are all the same in their negation.  Theism covers all gods. Atheism negates them all.

'No'. It's the same no to whatever is proposed.it is a universal negative.
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MeisterEckhart
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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #481 - Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:26pm
 
Frank wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:19pm:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:05pm:
Jasin wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 8:47pm:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 8:43pm:
Jasin wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 8:21pm:
You're both right, considering the foundation of Monotheism through Zoroastrianism and into the the Father Judaism, the Son Mohommedism and the Holy Ghost Christianity - was from PAGANISMS.

So Atheists would be against Paganisms, Animisms and any other form of 'ism'.

It would be easier for Atheists to just admit they are Scientists, but most can't because most just 'hate' Religion with a very 'Anti' state of being.

There are plenty of 'atheists' who disbelieve in a Yahweh/Moses-god but subscribe to spiritualism.


Well there's the catch and irony.
Spiritualism - in its physical form is 'fashion'.
Just as Writing is for Religion (ie: Book)
Spirituality & Religion are siblings.


Spiritualism is not a fashion - it is an age-old acknowledgement of the numinous.

And the difference between the numinous, the transcendental and the super-natural - are what?

Those sensibilities do not prove the existence of a Mosaic, or any other, god.
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Jasin
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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #482 - Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:26pm
 
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:05pm:
Jasin wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 8:47pm:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 8:43pm:
Jasin wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 8:21pm:
You're both right, considering the foundation of Monotheism through Zoroastrianism and into the the Father Judaism, the Son Mohommedism and the Holy Ghost Christianity - was from PAGANISMS.

So Atheists would be against Paganisms, Animisms and any other form of 'ism'.

It would be easier for Atheists to just admit they are Scientists, but most can't because most just 'hate' Religion with a very 'Anti' state of being.

There are plenty of 'atheists' who disbelieve in a Yahweh/Moses-god but subscribe to spiritualism.


Well there's the catch and irony.
Spiritualism - in its physical form is 'fashion'.
Just as Writing is for Religion (ie: Book)
Spirituality & Religion are siblings.


Spiritualism is not a fashion - it is an age-old acknowledgement of the numinous.

having a strong religious or spiritual quality; indicating or suggesting the presence of a divinity
And how exactly is that 'indication' or 'suggesting' - expressed?
Answer: Fashion.
...just ask any Hippie.  Grin
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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
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Bobby.
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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #483 - Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:32pm
 
To all those atheists -

do you believe there was a man called Jesus who whipped the Jewish money lenders in the temple?



...
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MeisterEckhart
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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #484 - Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:43pm
 
Jasin wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:26pm:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:05pm:
Jasin wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 8:47pm:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 8:43pm:
Jasin wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 8:21pm:
You're both right, considering the foundation of Monotheism through Zoroastrianism and into the the Father Judaism, the Son Mohommedism and the Holy Ghost Christianity - was from PAGANISMS.

So Atheists would be against Paganisms, Animisms and any other form of 'ism'.

It would be easier for Atheists to just admit they are Scientists, but most can't because most just 'hate' Religion with a very 'Anti' state of being.

There are plenty of 'atheists' who disbelieve in a Yahweh/Moses-god but subscribe to spiritualism.


Well there's the catch and irony.
Spiritualism - in its physical form is 'fashion'.
Just as Writing is for Religion (ie: Book)
Spirituality & Religion are siblings.


Spiritualism is not a fashion - it is an age-old acknowledgement of the numinous.

having a strong religious or spiritual quality; indicating or suggesting the presence of a divinity
And how exactly is that 'indication' or 'suggesting' - expressed?
Answer: Fashion.
...just ask any Hippie.  Grin

Fashion is transient. Spiritualism is as ancient as humanity.

Hunter-gatherer cultures all have a sense of the numinous, most without any sense of the theistic.
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Jasin
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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #485 - Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:50pm
 
The story of Adam & Eve is about them being 'naked' in the Garden and not attaining their 'spirituality' until after they realised their nakedness and clothed themselves, etc, etc, etc.

Spirituality, when you break it down into its 'physical' form (which can be believed, because it can be seen and experienced) - is Fashion.
Be it a Hippy's fashion.
An Accountant's power suit.
A Moslem's attire to keep the sand out of their vaginas.
A Tibetan Monk's robes.
A Military person standing out from the peasants.

Fashion is the truest expression of Spirituality.
Just as 'Writing' (which began as a Science) is the expression of Religion.

There is always something 'visual' about Spirituality and Art is it's good friend, like the Health is with the Fitness (Sport) industry, like the Cop is with the Soldier.
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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
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MeisterEckhart
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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #486 - Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:55pm
 
Jasin wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:50pm:
The story of Adam & Eve is about them being 'naked' in the Garden and not attaining their 'spirituality' until after they realised their nakedness and clothed themselves, etc, etc, etc.

Spirituality, when you break it down into its 'physical' form (which can be believed, because it can be seen and experienced) - is Fashion.
Be it a Hippy's fashion.
An Accountant's power suit.
A Moslem's attire to keep the sand out of their vaginas.
A Tibetan Monk's robes.
A Military person standing out from the peasants.

Fashion is the truest expression of Spirituality.
Just as 'Writing' (which began as a Science) is the expression of Religion.

There is always something 'visual' about Spirituality and Art is it's good friend, like the Health is with the Fitness (Sport) industry, like the Cop is with the Soldier.

The numinous is experienced when you witness wondrous natural events - e.g. volcanic eruptions, meteors, the night sky, a prodigiously fertile land - or via psychic phenomena after ingesting psychoactive organisms.

Experiences all human societies have been exposed to from the beginning.
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Setanta
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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #487 - Oct 5th, 2023 at 1:53am
 
Jasin wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:50pm:
The story of Adam & Eve is about them being 'naked' in the Garden and not attaining their 'spirituality' until after they realised their nakedness and clothed themselves, etc, etc, etc.

Spirituality, when you break it down into its 'physical' form (which can be believed, because it can be seen and experienced) - is Fashion.
Be it a Hippy's fashion.
An Accountant's power suit.
A Moslem's attire to keep the sand out of their vaginas.
A Tibetan Monk's robes.
A Military person standing out from the peasants.

Fashion is the truest expression of Spirituality.
Just as 'Writing' (which began as a Science) is the expression of Religion.

There is always something 'visual' about Spirituality and Art is it's good friend, like the Health is with the Fitness (Sport) industry, like the Cop is with the Soldier.


I see the Adam and Eve story as a metaphor for moving from HG to agriculture. You can't go back.
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Frank
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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #488 - Oct 5th, 2023 at 8:24am
 
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:26pm:
Frank wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:19pm:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:05pm:
Jasin wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 8:47pm:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 8:43pm:
Jasin wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 8:21pm:
You're both right, considering the foundation of Monotheism through Zoroastrianism and into the the Father Judaism, the Son Mohommedism and the Holy Ghost Christianity - was from PAGANISMS.

So Atheists would be against Paganisms, Animisms and any other form of 'ism'.

It would be easier for Atheists to just admit they are Scientists, but most can't because most just 'hate' Religion with a very 'Anti' state of being.

There are plenty of 'atheists' who disbelieve in a Yahweh/Moses-god but subscribe to spiritualism.


Well there's the catch and irony.
Spiritualism - in its physical form is 'fashion'.
Just as Writing is for Religion (ie: Book)
Spirituality & Religion are siblings.


Spiritualism is not a fashion - it is an age-old acknowledgement of the numinous.

And the difference between the numinous, the transcendental and the super-natural - are what?

Those sensibilities do not prove the existence of a Mosaic, or any other, god.


And the difference between the numinous, the transcendental and the super-natural - are what?
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Estragon: I can’t go on like this.
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Frank
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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #489 - Oct 5th, 2023 at 8:31am
 
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:55pm:
Jasin wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:50pm:
The story of Adam & Eve is about them being 'naked' in the Garden and not attaining their 'spirituality' until after they realised their nakedness and clothed themselves, etc, etc, etc.

Spirituality, when you break it down into its 'physical' form (which can be believed, because it can be seen and experienced) - is Fashion.
Be it a Hippy's fashion.
An Accountant's power suit.
A Moslem's attire to keep the sand out of their vaginas.
A Tibetan Monk's robes.
A Military person standing out from the peasants.

Fashion is the truest expression of Spirituality.
Just as 'Writing' (which began as a Science) is the expression of Religion.

There is always something 'visual' about Spirituality and Art is it's good friend, like the Health is with the Fitness (Sport) industry, like the Cop is with the Soldier.

The numinous is experienced when you witness wondrous natural events - e.g. volcanic eruptions, meteors, the night sky, a prodigiously fertile land - or via psychic phenomena after ingesting psychoactive organisms.

Experiences all human societies have been exposed to from the beginning.


That is not what numinous is, 'wondrous'.
It is the thing as it is beyond its phenomenological manifestations. The thing in itself, not just how it is perceived by the (limited) human senses.
https://www.britannica.com/topic/noumenon

Spinoza's one substance, of which everything is an attribute, things as well as ideas.
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MeisterEckhart
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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #490 - Oct 5th, 2023 at 9:25am
 
Frank wrote on Oct 5th, 2023 at 8:31am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:55pm:
Jasin wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:50pm:
The story of Adam & Eve is about them being 'naked' in the Garden and not attaining their 'spirituality' until after they realised their nakedness and clothed themselves, etc, etc, etc.

Spirituality, when you break it down into its 'physical' form (which can be believed, because it can be seen and experienced) - is Fashion.
Be it a Hippy's fashion.
An Accountant's power suit.
A Moslem's attire to keep the sand out of their vaginas.
A Tibetan Monk's robes.
A Military person standing out from the peasants.

Fashion is the truest expression of Spirituality.
Just as 'Writing' (which began as a Science) is the expression of Religion.

There is always something 'visual' about Spirituality and Art is it's good friend, like the Health is with the Fitness (Sport) industry, like the Cop is with the Soldier.

The numinous is experienced when you witness wondrous natural events - e.g. volcanic eruptions, meteors, the night sky, a prodigiously fertile land - or via psychic phenomena after ingesting psychoactive organisms.

Experiences all human societies have been exposed to from the beginning.


That is not what numinous is, 'wondrous'.
It is the thing as it is beyond its phenomenological manifestations. The thing in itself, not just how it is perceived by the (limited) human senses.
https://www.britannica.com/topic/noumenon

Spinoza's one substance, of which everything is an attribute, things as well as ideas.

numinous
/ˈnjuːmɪnəs/
adjective

having a strong religious or spiritual quality; indicating or suggesting the presence of a divinity.

"the strange, numinous beauty of this ancient landmark"

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Frank
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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #491 - Oct 5th, 2023 at 9:31am
 
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 5th, 2023 at 9:25am:
Frank wrote on Oct 5th, 2023 at 8:31am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:55pm:
Jasin wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:50pm:
The story of Adam & Eve is about them being 'naked' in the Garden and not attaining their 'spirituality' until after they realised their nakedness and clothed themselves, etc, etc, etc.

Spirituality, when you break it down into its 'physical' form (which can be believed, because it can be seen and experienced) - is Fashion.
Be it a Hippy's fashion.
An Accountant's power suit.
A Moslem's attire to keep the sand out of their vaginas.
A Tibetan Monk's robes.
A Military person standing out from the peasants.

Fashion is the truest expression of Spirituality.
Just as 'Writing' (which began as a Science) is the expression of Religion.

There is always something 'visual' about Spirituality and Art is it's good friend, like the Health is with the Fitness (Sport) industry, like the Cop is with the Soldier.

The numinous is experienced when you witness wondrous natural events - e.g. volcanic eruptions, meteors, the night sky, a prodigiously fertile land - or via psychic phenomena after ingesting psychoactive organisms.

Experiences all human societies have been exposed to from the beginning.


That is not what numinous is, 'wondrous'.
It is the thing as it is beyond its phenomenological manifestations. The thing in itself, not just how it is perceived by the (limited) human senses.
https://www.britannica.com/topic/noumenon

Spinoza's one substance, of which everything is an attribute, things as well as ideas.

numinous
/ˈnjuːmɪnəs/
adjective

having a strong religious or spiritual quality; indicating or suggesting the presence of a divinity.

"the strange, numinous beauty of this ancient landmark"



Apprehension, apperception of the non-empirical.
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Estragon: I can’t go on like this.
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MeisterEckhart
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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #492 - Oct 5th, 2023 at 9:36am
 
Frank wrote on Oct 5th, 2023 at 9:31am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 5th, 2023 at 9:25am:
Frank wrote on Oct 5th, 2023 at 8:31am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:55pm:
Jasin wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:50pm:
The story of Adam & Eve is about them being 'naked' in the Garden and not attaining their 'spirituality' until after they realised their nakedness and clothed themselves, etc, etc, etc.

Spirituality, when you break it down into its 'physical' form (which can be believed, because it can be seen and experienced) - is Fashion.
Be it a Hippy's fashion.
An Accountant's power suit.
A Moslem's attire to keep the sand out of their vaginas.
A Tibetan Monk's robes.
A Military person standing out from the peasants.

Fashion is the truest expression of Spirituality.
Just as 'Writing' (which began as a Science) is the expression of Religion.

There is always something 'visual' about Spirituality and Art is it's good friend, like the Health is with the Fitness (Sport) industry, like the Cop is with the Soldier.

The numinous is experienced when you witness wondrous natural events - e.g. volcanic eruptions, meteors, the night sky, a prodigiously fertile land - or via psychic phenomena after ingesting psychoactive organisms.

Experiences all human societies have been exposed to from the beginning.


That is not what numinous is, 'wondrous'.
It is the thing as it is beyond its phenomenological manifestations. The thing in itself, not just how it is perceived by the (limited) human senses.
https://www.britannica.com/topic/noumenon

Spinoza's one substance, of which everything is an attribute, things as well as ideas.

numinous
/ˈnjuːmɪnəs/
adjective

having a strong religious or spiritual quality; indicating or suggesting the presence of a divinity.

"the strange, numinous beauty of this ancient landmark"



Apprehension, apperception of the non-empirical.

The sense of awe that rises when we witness a phenomenon which appears inexplicable or counter-intuitive.

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Frank
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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #493 - Oct 5th, 2023 at 9:45am
 
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 5th, 2023 at 9:36am:
Frank wrote on Oct 5th, 2023 at 9:31am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 5th, 2023 at 9:25am:
Frank wrote on Oct 5th, 2023 at 8:31am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:55pm:
Jasin wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:50pm:
The story of Adam & Eve is about them being 'naked' in the Garden and not attaining their 'spirituality' until after they realised their nakedness and clothed themselves, etc, etc, etc.

Spirituality, when you break it down into its 'physical' form (which can be believed, because it can be seen and experienced) - is Fashion.
Be it a Hippy's fashion.
An Accountant's power suit.
A Moslem's attire to keep the sand out of their vaginas.
A Tibetan Monk's robes.
A Military person standing out from the peasants.

Fashion is the truest expression of Spirituality.
Just as 'Writing' (which began as a Science) is the expression of Religion.

There is always something 'visual' about Spirituality and Art is it's good friend, like the Health is with the Fitness (Sport) industry, like the Cop is with the Soldier.

The numinous is experienced when you witness wondrous natural events - e.g. volcanic eruptions, meteors, the night sky, a prodigiously fertile land - or via psychic phenomena after ingesting psychoactive organisms.

Experiences all human societies have been exposed to from the beginning.


That is not what numinous is, 'wondrous'.
It is the thing as it is beyond its phenomenological manifestations. The thing in itself, not just how it is perceived by the (limited) human senses.
https://www.britannica.com/topic/noumenon

Spinoza's one substance, of which everything is an attribute, things as well as ideas.

numinous
/ˈnjuːmɪnəs/
adjective

having a strong religious or spiritual quality; indicating or suggesting the presence of a divinity.

"the strange, numinous beauty of this ancient landmark"



Apprehension, apperception of the non-empirical.

The sense of awe that rises when we witness a phenomenon which appears inexplicable or counter-intuitive.


Divine. Don't be afraid of the word. It's in your own definition of the numerous.

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Estragon: I can’t go on like this.
Vladimir: That’s what you think.
 
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MeisterEckhart
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Re: Does Atheism really exist?
Reply #494 - Oct 5th, 2023 at 9:48am
 
Frank wrote on Oct 5th, 2023 at 9:45am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 5th, 2023 at 9:36am:
Frank wrote on Oct 5th, 2023 at 9:31am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 5th, 2023 at 9:25am:
Frank wrote on Oct 5th, 2023 at 8:31am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:55pm:
Jasin wrote on Oct 4th, 2023 at 9:50pm:
The story of Adam & Eve is about them being 'naked' in the Garden and not attaining their 'spirituality' until after they realised their nakedness and clothed themselves, etc, etc, etc.

Spirituality, when you break it down into its 'physical' form (which can be believed, because it can be seen and experienced) - is Fashion.
Be it a Hippy's fashion.
An Accountant's power suit.
A Moslem's attire to keep the sand out of their vaginas.
A Tibetan Monk's robes.
A Military person standing out from the peasants.

Fashion is the truest expression of Spirituality.
Just as 'Writing' (which began as a Science) is the expression of Religion.

There is always something 'visual' about Spirituality and Art is it's good friend, like the Health is with the Fitness (Sport) industry, like the Cop is with the Soldier.

The numinous is experienced when you witness wondrous natural events - e.g. volcanic eruptions, meteors, the night sky, a prodigiously fertile land - or via psychic phenomena after ingesting psychoactive organisms.

Experiences all human societies have been exposed to from the beginning.


That is not what numinous is, 'wondrous'.
It is the thing as it is beyond its phenomenological manifestations. The thing in itself, not just how it is perceived by the (limited) human senses.
https://www.britannica.com/topic/noumenon

Spinoza's one substance, of which everything is an attribute, things as well as ideas.

numinous
/ˈnjuːmɪnəs/
adjective

having a strong religious or spiritual quality; indicating or suggesting the presence of a divinity.

"the strange, numinous beauty of this ancient landmark"



Apprehension, apperception of the non-empirical.

The sense of awe that rises when we witness a phenomenon which appears inexplicable or counter-intuitive.


Divine. Don't be afraid of the word. It's in your own definition of the numerous.


It is in that definition as - indicating or suggesting the presence of a divinity - not proving the presence of a divinity.
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