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The human cost in Gaza (Read 78113 times)
John Smith
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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #690 - Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:15am
 
aquascoot wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 6:57am:
Peckery Fisk and Smith don't have any interest in the children


you mean we have no interest in the slaughter of children

Unlike you, who is intent to encourage and cheer it on
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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.
 
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Bobby.
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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #691 - Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:16am
 
MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 7:58am:
Bobby. wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 7:54am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 7:46am:
Bobby. wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 7:40am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 7:25am:
Jasin wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 5:22am:
Maybe they should drop a couple of Atomic Bombs on the women and children, like the USA did to Hiroshima & Nagasaki - which 'ended the war'?
Your beloved 'Democracy' is it not?

And, though Hiroshima and Nagasaki get all the press, the worst bombing in world history was the firebombing of Tokyo in March of 1945,



I think the world was hoping we'd left all that to shameful history?

War, (or at least the sense of its inevitability), is part of the human instinct.

As is committing disproportionate revenge for the damage done to the ingroup by 'the other'.




It's illegal to point a firearm at another person but somehow
Govts. think they can point nuclear missiles at entire cities
and threaten: the lives of millions of people and to destroy the entire planet.
It's madness and it should have been sorted out 77 years ago in 1946.

Our socio-political system can't and doesn't eliminate the instinct for war.

We, as individuals, cede the use of (lethal) force, as the ultimate tool in the settling of affairs, to the state.



Would you accept walking around all day with a loaded gun pointed at your head?

The fact that we still have nuclear weapons pointed at all of us
proves that our world leaders have failed us - miserably.


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aquascoot
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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #692 - Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:17am
 
John Smith wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:15am:
aquascoot wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 6:57am:
Peckery Fisk and Smith don't have any interest in the children


you mean we have no interest in the slaughter of children

Unlike you, who is intent to encourage and cheer it on



Nope you love it
It gives you an opportunity to bond with other idiots
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MeisterEckhart
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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #693 - Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:18am
 
Bobby. wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:16am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 7:58am:
Bobby. wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 7:54am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 7:46am:
Bobby. wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 7:40am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 7:25am:
Jasin wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 5:22am:
Maybe they should drop a couple of Atomic Bombs on the women and children, like the USA did to Hiroshima & Nagasaki - which 'ended the war'?
Your beloved 'Democracy' is it not?

And, though Hiroshima and Nagasaki get all the press, the worst bombing in world history was the firebombing of Tokyo in March of 1945,



I think the world was hoping we'd left all that to shameful history?

War, (or at least the sense of its inevitability), is part of the human instinct.

As is committing disproportionate revenge for the damage done to the ingroup by 'the other'.




It's illegal to point a firearm at another person but somehow
Govts. think they can point nuclear missiles at entire cities
and threaten: the lives of millions of people and to destroy the entire planet.
It's madness and it should have been sorted out 77 years ago in 1946.

Our socio-political system can't and doesn't eliminate the instinct for war.

We, as individuals, cede the use of (lethal) force, as the ultimate tool in the settling of affairs, to the state.



Would you accept walking around all day with a loaded gun pointed at your head?

The fact that we still have nuclear weapons pointed at all of us
proves that our world leaders have failed us - miserably.



Would you prefer that our outgroup enemies have all the weapons and we have none, or not enough, to match the threat?
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freediver
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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #694 - Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:22am
 
MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:11am:
freediver wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:04am:
Quote:
Our socio-political system can't and doesn't eliminate the instinct for war.


Yes it does. And there is no instinct for war. It takes a lot of training the overcome our instinct to avoid war.

There are few times in history where the threat of war or the meting out of lethal force against the ingroup by 'the other' is not a feature.


Can you give an example of a war in which both sides were lead by democracies?
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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.
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Bobby.
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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #695 - Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:22am
 
MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:18am:
Bobby. wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:16am:
Would you accept walking around all day with a loaded gun pointed at your head?

The fact that we still have nuclear weapons pointed at all of us
proves that our world leaders have failed us - miserably.



Would you prefer that our outgroup enemies have all the weapons and we have none, or not enough, to match the threat?



Our leaders needed to find a solution.
Reagan was on the right path - trust but verify -
get rid of all nuclear weapons.
The problem has been - no trust.

Now that tensions are so high in the Middle East and Ukraine,  nuclear war is more likely.

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John Smith
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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #696 - Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:24am
 
aquascoot wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:17am:
John Smith wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:15am:
aquascoot wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 6:57am:
Peckery Fisk and Smith don't have any interest in the children


you mean we have no interest in the slaughter of children

Unlike you, who is intent to encourage and cheer it on



Nope you love it
It gives you an opportunity to bond with other idiots



Grin Grin
Unlike you, I don't come on here to 'bond'.
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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.
 
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Bobby.
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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #697 - Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:26am
 
https://edition.cnn.com/middleeast/live-news/israel-hamas-war-gaza-news-11-03-23...


Analysis: Hezbollah isn’t going to war with Israel, for now


Analysis by CNN’s Tamara Qiblawi

For weeks, Lebanon was preparing for war. People spoke about their backup plans in hushed tones. The government said it was putting together contingency supplies for the public’s basic necessities.

It all hinged on Hezbollah Secretary General Hassan Nasrallah’s thinking about the Hamas-Israel war, which he kept close to his chest before breaking his nearly month-long silence about October 7 on Friday.

In a fiery speech from an undisclosed location, the reclusive head of the Iran-backed Lebanese militant group heaped praise on Hamas and hailed the war as a “turning point” in the Arab-Israeli conflict. He extolled the virtues of the weekslong cross-fire with Israel on Lebanon’s southern border, which he described as an “unprecedented battle.”

He also said Hezbollah would be "prepared for all scenarios,” and that any escalation by the Israeli army at the border would be a "historic folly" that would prompt a major response.

Yet for all the tough talk, Nasrallah was not banging war drums. He said Hezbollah’s “primary goal” was to achieve a ceasefire in Gaza, and said it was incumbent on the US — which he held directly responsible for the bloodshed in the Palestinian enclave — to implement the cessation of hostilities.

What this tells us is that Nasrallah’s immediate plans do not include a broader conflict.

This may come as a disappointment to many in the Arab street. When the pro-Palestinian demonstrations washed over much of the region in recent weeks, many of the chants called on Nasrallah to go to war.

But it will be a relief to Israel’s Western allies, who fear a wider regional conflict and have repeatedly warned Nasrallah not to enter the fray. Two US aircraft carriers — including the nuclear-power USS Gerald Ford — were dispatched to the Mediterranean in an apparent bid to deter Hezbollah.

That relief will be shared by many in Lebanon. The tiny eastern Mediterranean country has barely recovered from the devastating economic crisis of 2019, and much of the population — while horrified by the soaring death toll and widespread destruction wrought by Israel’s offensive in Gaza — has been worn down by decades of war and crises.

Nasrallah may have been restrained by that popular sentiment, or he may have concluded, after weeks of deliberation, that his powerful paramilitary has too much to lose in a war with Israel.
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MeisterEckhart
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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #698 - Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:29am
 
freediver wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:22am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:11am:
freediver wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:04am:
Quote:
Our socio-political system can't and doesn't eliminate the instinct for war.


Yes it does. And there is no instinct for war. It takes a lot of training the overcome our instinct to avoid war.

There are few times in history where the threat of war or the meting out of lethal force against the ingroup by 'the other' is not a feature.


Can you give an example of a war in which both sides were lead by democracies?

No. Democracies have successfully managed to focus their citizens' instinct for war into preparation for war as a deterrent to allow diplomacy to negotiate alternatives. It has not eliminated the instinctive sense of war's inevitability.

Can you give examples of where leading democracies have not been prepared for war or prosecuted war - sometimes even planted the seeds for inevitable war?
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freediver
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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #699 - Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:31am
 
MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:29am:
freediver wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:22am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:11am:
freediver wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:04am:
Quote:
Our socio-political system can't and doesn't eliminate the instinct for war.


Yes it does. And there is no instinct for war. It takes a lot of training the overcome our instinct to avoid war.

There are few times in history where the threat of war or the meting out of lethal force against the ingroup by 'the other' is not a feature.


Can you give an example of a war in which both sides were lead by democracies?

No. Democracies have successfully managed to focus their citizens' instinct for war into preparation for war as a deterrent to allow diplomacy to negotiate alternatives. It has not eliminated the instinctive sense of war's inevitability.

Can you give examples of where leading democracies have not been prepared for war or prosecuted war - sometimes even planted the seeds for inevitable war?


Most people who live in liberal democracies do not expect to go through a war. But it is still sensible to maintain your ability to defend yourself.
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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.
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MeisterEckhart
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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #700 - Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:33am
 
freediver wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:31am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:29am:
freediver wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:22am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:11am:
freediver wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:04am:
Quote:
Our socio-political system can't and doesn't eliminate the instinct for war.


Yes it does. And there is no instinct for war. It takes a lot of training the overcome our instinct to avoid war.

There are few times in history where the threat of war or the meting out of lethal force against the ingroup by 'the other' is not a feature.


Can you give an example of a war in which both sides were lead by democracies?

No. Democracies have successfully managed to focus their citizens' instinct for war into preparation for war as a deterrent to allow diplomacy to negotiate alternatives. It has not eliminated the instinctive sense of war's inevitability.

Can you give examples of where leading democracies have not been prepared for war or prosecuted war - sometimes even planted the seeds for inevitable war?


Most people who live in liberal democracies do not expect to go through a war. But it is still sensible to maintain your ability to defend yourself.

Why is it sensible?
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Bobby.
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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #701 - Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:34am
 
freediver wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:31am:
Most people who live in liberal democracies do not expect to go through a war. But it is still sensible to maintain your ability to defend yourself.



My belief is that arms races we see are a shocking waste of resources.
Why can't the world leaders meet and all decide to reduce their arms spending every year
until no country has the military power to destroy another country?

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freediver
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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #702 - Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:40am
 
MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:33am:
freediver wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:31am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:29am:
freediver wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:22am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:11am:
freediver wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:04am:
Quote:
Our socio-political system can't and doesn't eliminate the instinct for war.


Yes it does. And there is no instinct for war. It takes a lot of training the overcome our instinct to avoid war.

There are few times in history where the threat of war or the meting out of lethal force against the ingroup by 'the other' is not a feature.


Can you give an example of a war in which both sides were lead by democracies?

No. Democracies have successfully managed to focus their citizens' instinct for war into preparation for war as a deterrent to allow diplomacy to negotiate alternatives. It has not eliminated the instinctive sense of war's inevitability.

Can you give examples of where leading democracies have not been prepared for war or prosecuted war - sometimes even planted the seeds for inevitable war?


Most people who live in liberal democracies do not expect to go through a war. But it is still sensible to maintain your ability to defend yourself.

Why is it sensible?


Because someone will take advantage if you don't. Maybe these days you could get away with no military and rely on other countries such as the US to defend you, but that is really just passing the buck.

Bobby. wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:34am:
freediver wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:31am:
Most people who live in liberal democracies do not expect to go through a war. But it is still sensible to maintain your ability to defend yourself.



My belief is that arms races we see are a shocking waste of resources.
Why can't the world leaders meet and all decide to reduce their arms spending every year
until no country has the military power to destroy another country?



There are far simpler things they cannot agree on Bobby. What makes this more difficult is that as soon you you do, it increases the incentive to make war, because there are easy pickings to be had.
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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.
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MeisterEckhart
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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #703 - Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:43am
 
Bobby. wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:34am:
freediver wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:31am:
Most people who live in liberal democracies do not expect to go through a war. But it is still sensible to maintain your ability to defend yourself.



My belief is that arms races we see are a shocking waste of resources.
Why can't the world leaders meet and all decide to reduce their arms spending every year
until no country has the military power to destroy another country?


I agree. Preparation for war comes at a gargantuan cost, which only reinforces that the human instinct for war not only permits that expenditure, it also values that preparation over any other single expenditure.

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MeisterEckhart
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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #704 - Nov 4th, 2023 at 9:42am
 
freediver wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:40am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:33am:
freediver wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:31am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:29am:
freediver wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:22am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:11am:
freediver wrote on Nov 4th, 2023 at 8:04am:
Quote:
Our socio-political system can't and doesn't eliminate the instinct for war.


Yes it does. And there is no instinct for war. It takes a lot of training the overcome our instinct to avoid war.

There are few times in history where the threat of war or the meting out of lethal force against the ingroup by 'the other' is not a feature.


Can you give an example of a war in which both sides were lead by democracies?

No. Democracies have successfully managed to focus their citizens' instinct for war into preparation for war as a deterrent to allow diplomacy to negotiate alternatives. It has not eliminated the instinctive sense of war's inevitability.

Can you give examples of where leading democracies have not been prepared for war or prosecuted war - sometimes even planted the seeds for inevitable war?


Most people who live in liberal democracies do not expect to go through a war. But it is still sensible to maintain your ability to defend yourself.

Why is it sensible?


Because someone will take advantage if you don't. Maybe these days you could get away with no military and rely on other countries such as the US to defend you, but that is really just passing the buck.

Yes, I agree.

Humans and other primates have evolved both to evade predators and to predate.

It's why sometimes we manifest the instincts like that of a zebra and other times like that of a lion.
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