Australian Politics Forum - The human cost in Gaza

aquascoot

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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #825 - Nov 6^th, 2023 at 5:03pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 4:59pm:

Was listening to a rabbi explaining why the land of Canaan belonged to the Jewish people using the Jewish bible (the Old Testament) as if it were an accurate historical document.

Even Israeli Jewish archaeologists almost universally agree that Moses almost certainly did not actually exist, at least not in the way it is recorded in Exodus.

There are no Egyptian records of a Jewish adopted cousin of Rameses II, or any other pharaoh, named Moses or any other name.

Archeologists have determined that the mountain where Moses received the Ten Commandments is not the actual Mount Sinai known today and the actual Mount is not known with no convincing evidence found at any of the other candidate sites.

So, if Moses didn't exist, then the Jewish historical claim on the land of Canaan is a myth.

well yes, but do you believe an angel appeared to Mo in some cave and gave him the ultimate truth ?

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #826 - Nov 6^th, 2023 at 5:29pm

aquascoot wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 5:03pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 4:59pm:

Was listening to a rabbi explaining why the land of Canaan belonged to the Jewish people using the Jewish bible (the Old Testament) as if it were an accurate historical document.

Even Israeli Jewish archaeologists almost universally agree that Moses almost certainly did not actually exist, at least not in the way it is recorded in Exodus.

There are no Egyptian records of a Jewish adopted cousin of Rameses II, or any other pharaoh, named Moses or any other name.

Archeologists have determined that the mountain where Moses received the Ten Commandments is not the actual Mount Sinai known today and the actual Mount is not known with no convincing evidence found at any of the other candidate sites.

So, if Moses didn't exist, then the Jewish historical claim on the land of Canaan is a myth.

well yes, but do you believe an angel appeared to Mo in some cave and gave him the ultimate truth ?

No, but it's not surprising that Gabriel appears in the Quran to impart to Mohammed the truth and temporarily gives Mohammed the power to read and write (he is illiterate).

Gabriel appears in the Tanakh (the Jewish bible), the New Testament and the Quran - he is the mythical messenger of El/Yahweh / Allah.

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Setanta

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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #827 - Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:16pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 4:59pm:

Was listening to a rabbi explaining why the land of Canaan belonged to the Jewish people using the Jewish bible (the Old Testament) as if it were an accurate historical document.

Even Israeli Jewish archaeologists almost universally agree that Moses almost certainly did not actually exist, at least not in the way it is recorded in Exodus.

There are no Egyptian records of a Jewish adopted cousin of Rameses II, or any other pharaoh, named Moses or any other name.

Archeologists have determined that the mountain where Moses received the Ten Commandments is not the actual Mount Sinai known today and the actual Mount is not known with no convincing evidence found at any of the other candidate sites.

So, if Moses didn't exist, then the Jewish historical claim on the land of Canaan is a myth.

Not really true as far as I know. Archaeology shows that the Israelites/jews were a native population with a new idea of god. They were never in Egypt, they were a part of the local Canannite population, probably from the hills rather than the coast. They were not always monotheistic.

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Bobby. Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 105429 Melbourne Gender:	Re: The human cost in Gaza Reply #828 - Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:22pm The Jews live in the promised land - promised by Moses via God himself.
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MeisterEckhart

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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #829 - Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:32pm

Setanta wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:16pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 4:59pm:

Was listening to a rabbi explaining why the land of Canaan belonged to the Jewish people using the Jewish bible (the Old Testament) as if it were an accurate historical document.

Even Israeli Jewish archaeologists almost universally agree that Moses almost certainly did not actually exist, at least not in the way it is recorded in Exodus.

There are no Egyptian records of a Jewish adopted cousin of Rameses II, or any other pharaoh, named Moses or any other name.

Archeologists have determined that the mountain where Moses received the Ten Commandments is not the actual Mount Sinai known today and the actual Mount is not known with no convincing evidence found at any of the other candidate sites.

So, if Moses didn't exist, then the Jewish historical claim on the land of Canaan is a myth.

Not really true as far as I know. Archaeology shows that the Israelites/jews were a native population with a new idea of god. They were never in Egypt, they were a part of the local Canannite population, probably from the hills rather than the coast. They were not always monotheistic.

There's serious doubt that they were ever enslaved in Egypt, but it's possible they migrated to Egypt during times of drought where they would have been subject to the rule of the pharaohs who would have required them to honour whichever Egyptian god(s) was acceptable, over their one Jewish god.

And their one god was not always Yahweh. Abraham's god was El - hence Ishra-El - Israel (we who struggle with god).

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Setanta Gold Member Offline \/ Peace man! Posts: 16615 Northern NSW Gender:	Re: The human cost in Gaza Reply #830 - Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:34pm Bobby. wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:22pm: The Jews live in the promised land - promised by Moses via God himself. He bru, I'm strendid. Beached iz bru. Plinkton is what is needed.
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Setanta

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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #831 - Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:35pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:32pm:

Setanta wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:16pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 4:59pm:

Was listening to a rabbi explaining why the land of Canaan belonged to the Jewish people using the Jewish bible (the Old Testament) as if it were an accurate historical document.

Even Israeli Jewish archaeologists almost universally agree that Moses almost certainly did not actually exist, at least not in the way it is recorded in Exodus.

There are no Egyptian records of a Jewish adopted cousin of Rameses II, or any other pharaoh, named Moses or any other name.

Archeologists have determined that the mountain where Moses received the Ten Commandments is not the actual Mount Sinai known today and the actual Mount is not known with no convincing evidence found at any of the other candidate sites.

So, if Moses didn't exist, then the Jewish historical claim on the land of Canaan is a myth.

Not really true as far as I know. Archaeology shows that the Israelites/jews were a native population with a new idea of god. They were never in Egypt, they were a part of the local Canannite population, probably from the hills rather than the coast. They were not always monotheistic.

There's serious doubt that they were ever enslaved in Egypt, but it's possible they migrated to Egypt during times of drought where they would have been subject to the rule of the pharaohs who would have required them to honour whichever Egyptian god(s) was acceptable, over their one Jewish god.

And their one god was not always Yahweh. Abraham's god was El - hence Ishra-El - Israel (we who struggle with god).

And El was the head of the Canaanite pantheon.

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greggerypeccary Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 137862 Gender:	Re: The human cost in Gaza Reply #832 - Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:36pm Setanta wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:34pm: Bobby. wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:22pm: The Jews live in the promised land - promised by Moses via God himself. He bru, I'm strendid. Beached iz bru. Plinkton is what is needed.
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MeisterEckhart

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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #833 - Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:43pm

Setanta wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:35pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:32pm:

Setanta wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:16pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 4:59pm:

Was listening to a rabbi explaining why the land of Canaan belonged to the Jewish people using the Jewish bible (the Old Testament) as if it were an accurate historical document.

Even Israeli Jewish archaeologists almost universally agree that Moses almost certainly did not actually exist, at least not in the way it is recorded in Exodus.

There are no Egyptian records of a Jewish adopted cousin of Rameses II, or any other pharaoh, named Moses or any other name.

Archeologists have determined that the mountain where Moses received the Ten Commandments is not the actual Mount Sinai known today and the actual Mount is not known with no convincing evidence found at any of the other candidate sites.

So, if Moses didn't exist, then the Jewish historical claim on the land of Canaan is a myth.

Not really true as far as I know. Archaeology shows that the Israelites/jews were a native population with a new idea of god. They were never in Egypt, they were a part of the local Canannite population, probably from the hills rather than the coast. They were not always monotheistic.

There's serious doubt that they were ever enslaved in Egypt, but it's possible they migrated to Egypt during times of drought where they would have been subject to the rule of the pharaohs who would have required them to honour whichever Egyptian god(s) was acceptable, over their one Jewish god.

And their one god was not always Yahweh. Abraham's god was El - hence Ishra-El - Israel (we who struggle with god).

And El was the head of the Canaanite pantheon.

Yes. Even the first commandment acknowledged other gods that must not come before El/Yahweh: You shall have no other gods before me.

Nothing about no other gods exist.

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Bobby. Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 105429 Melbourne Gender:	Re: The human cost in Gaza Reply #834 - Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:44pm Setanta wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:34pm: Bobby. wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:22pm: The Jews live in the promised land - promised by Moses via God himself. He bru, I'm strendid. Beached iz bru. Plinkton is what is needed. Me no understand lingo?
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Setanta

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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #835 - Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:48pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:43pm:

Setanta wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:35pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:32pm:

Setanta wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:16pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 4:59pm:

Was listening to a rabbi explaining why the land of Canaan belonged to the Jewish people using the Jewish bible (the Old Testament) as if it were an accurate historical document.

Even Israeli Jewish archaeologists almost universally agree that Moses almost certainly did not actually exist, at least not in the way it is recorded in Exodus.

There are no Egyptian records of a Jewish adopted cousin of Rameses II, or any other pharaoh, named Moses or any other name.

Archeologists have determined that the mountain where Moses received the Ten Commandments is not the actual Mount Sinai known today and the actual Mount is not known with no convincing evidence found at any of the other candidate sites.

So, if Moses didn't exist, then the Jewish historical claim on the land of Canaan is a myth.

Not really true as far as I know. Archaeology shows that the Israelites/jews were a native population with a new idea of god. They were never in Egypt, they were a part of the local Canannite population, probably from the hills rather than the coast. They were not always monotheistic.

There's serious doubt that they were ever enslaved in Egypt, but it's possible they migrated to Egypt during times of drought where they would have been subject to the rule of the pharaohs who would have required them to honour whichever Egyptian god(s) was acceptable, over their one Jewish god.

And their one god was not always Yahweh. Abraham's god was El - hence Ishra-El - Israel (we who struggle with god).

And El was the head of the Canaanite pantheon.

Yes. Even the first commandment acknowledged other gods that must not come before El/Yahweh: You shall have no other gods before me.

Nothing about no other gods exist.

My point is they have always been locals, not Egyptian slave escapees. Everything dug up reinforces that. Jews Hebrews are not interlopers, they are native.

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #836 - Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:53pm

Setanta wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:48pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:43pm:

Setanta wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:35pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:32pm:

Setanta wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:16pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 4:59pm:

Was listening to a rabbi explaining why the land of Canaan belonged to the Jewish people using the Jewish bible (the Old Testament) as if it were an accurate historical document.

Even Israeli Jewish archaeologists almost universally agree that Moses almost certainly did not actually exist, at least not in the way it is recorded in Exodus.

There are no Egyptian records of a Jewish adopted cousin of Rameses II, or any other pharaoh, named Moses or any other name.

Archeologists have determined that the mountain where Moses received the Ten Commandments is not the actual Mount Sinai known today and the actual Mount is not known with no convincing evidence found at any of the other candidate sites.

So, if Moses didn't exist, then the Jewish historical claim on the land of Canaan is a myth.

Not really true as far as I know. Archaeology shows that the Israelites/jews were a native population with a new idea of god. They were never in Egypt, they were a part of the local Canannite population, probably from the hills rather than the coast. They were not always monotheistic.

There's serious doubt that they were ever enslaved in Egypt, but it's possible they migrated to Egypt during times of drought where they would have been subject to the rule of the pharaohs who would have required them to honour whichever Egyptian god(s) was acceptable, over their one Jewish god.

And their one god was not always Yahweh. Abraham's god was El - hence Ishra-El - Israel (we who struggle with god).

And El was the head of the Canaanite pantheon.

Yes. Even the first commandment acknowledged other gods that must not come before El/Yahweh: You shall have no other gods before me.

Nothing about no other gods exist.

My point is they have always been locals, not Egyptian slave escapees. Everything dug up reinforces that. Jews Hebrews are not interlopers, they are native.

Yes, I'm sure they were, Where else would they have come from? Mongolia?

But ancient Hebrews are not ethically related to modern Ashkenazi Jews, who are descended from a Turkic people and are not Semites.

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Bobby.

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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #837 - Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:55pm

https://michaelwest.com.au/australian-arms-exports-to-israel-data-sought-in-cour...

Australian arms exports to Israel data sought in court

November 6, 2023 06:00 | News

Australia has approved 322 defence exports to Israel over the past six years, according to figures revealed during a Senate hearing last month.

Pressed on whether Australian weapons were being used against civilians in Gaza, Defence Ministry Deputy Secretary Hugh Jeffrey told the hearing such exports weren’t lethal in nature and included items such as radios, body armour, software, vehicle parts and sporting equipment.

The ministry maintains that all defence exports including the permits that Australia has approved to Israel have been assessed against stringent and robust export guidelines and international obligations.

But the groups contend, Australia may not be making decisions in accordance with domestic law and may be breaching international humanitarian law such as the Geneva Conventions.

“We are seeing the makings of a genocide unfold in front of our eyes,” Al Mezan Centre director Issam Younis said of the events in Gaza.

“If Australia is selling Israel the means to commit that genocide, it would not only be an unspeakable horror committed against the Palestinian people, it would breach Australia’s obligations under international law and its own rules around arms exports.”

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chimera Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 11600 armidale Gender:	Re: The human cost in Gaza Reply #838 - Nov 6^th, 2023 at 7:05pm In 2020, 33,786 litres of Australian wine was exported to Israel. Breathing wine fumes in Gaza would be deadly.
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MeisterEckhart

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Re: The human cost in Gaza
Reply #839 - Nov 6^th, 2023 at 7:08pm

Bobby. wrote on Nov 6^th, 2023 at 6:55pm:

https://michaelwest.com.au/australian-arms-exports-to-israel-data-sought-in-cour...

Australian arms exports to Israel data sought in court

November 6, 2023 06:00 | News

Australia has approved 322 defence exports to Israel over the past six years, according to figures revealed during a Senate hearing last month.

Pressed on whether Australian weapons were being used against civilians in Gaza, Defence Ministry Deputy Secretary Hugh Jeffrey told the hearing such exports weren’t lethal in nature and included items such as radios, body armour, software, vehicle parts and sporting equipment.

The ministry maintains that all defence exports including the permits that Australia has approved to Israel have been assessed against stringent and robust export guidelines and international obligations.

But the groups contend, Australia may not be making decisions in accordance with domestic law and may be breaching international humanitarian law such as the Geneva Conventions.

“We are seeing the makings of a genocide unfold in front of our eyes,” Al Mezan Centre director Issam Younis said of the events in Gaza.

“If Australia is selling Israel the means to commit that genocide, it would not only be an unspeakable horror committed against the Palestinian people, it would breach Australia’s obligations under international law and its own rules around arms exports.”

There's always a wanker trying to make headlines with whackjob ideas to drill into the minds of the gullible.

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