Give up while you're not ahead...

"Social conditions create a predisposition for alcoholism, medical expert says, not genetics"

What an interesting opinion - so now we accept the opinion of one 'expert' as being the sole source of reality... there is NO 'predisposition' to alcoholism - there is a choice to adopt it ..

Don't be a nong - you lost the moment you opened your mouth... now drop your childish attitude... that's once.

.

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Jan 20^th, 2024 at 10:38am:


It's not on till next week. It will be a peaceful, friendly occasion. Last year's was quite interesting. They let everyone who wanted to get on the soapbox, even the detractors.

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Jan 20^th, 2024 at 3:15pm:


"the "expert" is asserting YOUR  case against genetic predispostion, but he is also arguing MY (other)  case that entrenched poverty  causes 'learned hopelessness' (in welfare dependency)."

Please address, or be exposed as a fraud, or mentally incompetent (most likely). 

thegreatdivide wrote on Jan 20^th, 2024 at 3:37pm:


'exposed' as nothing.... you are turning around - you've always certified the victimhood industry - it's the fault of the way our society runs... no personal ownership of your own problems...

You really have no idea - and I have zero obligation to engage in endless and mindless argument with you.

NOTHING you've said so far supports the contention that a single 'expert' is the bee's knees of knowledge... like DUH...

How Far Flung Chinee Restaurant

Speciar for today -

Yu Ah Sum Ah So - fat-free soft sausage, sharp spi xi tong

Sum Dum Cun - abalone with fish sauce,  prawn head with butterfly brain.

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Jan 20^th, 2024 at 6:45pm:


"the victimhood industry" doesn't exist, people claiming they are hurt by certain policies does exist, though their arguments are sometimes flawed/misplaced. 

eg, the gap does exist, but blacks claiming it's "because Oz doesn't respect our culture" is a faulty argument.

Quote:


Wrong, I just gave an example...

Quote:


You have an obligation to counter the specifics of an argument, before claiming I'm ignorant/a parrot (or whatever).

We were examining personal responsibility;   I linked  to articles showing factors beyond personal responsbility, eg. macroeconomic factors (like the fool Bullock's monetary policies) which may be implicated in  the existance of individuals' unemployment and poverty. 

Quote:


I grabbed the first page which came up, examining alcohol and blacks;  the expert claimed poverty causes alcoholism, not genes.

Other experts have this to say:

Alcohol use disorder (AUD) often seems to run in families, and we may hear about scientific studies of an “alcoholism gene.” Genetics certainly influence our likelihood of developing AUD, but the story isn't so simple. Research shows that genes are responsible for about half of the risk for AUD.

About half - which reduces the efficacy of personal  responsibility.  Searching further: 

Around 50% to 60% of a person's risk for alcoholism is due to genetic factors. This means that genetics play a large role in alcoholism. But environmental factors and the interactions between genetics and the environment are also important.

And those "environmental factors" were already listed in my earlier linked article. 

Can you link to an article which claims 'personal responsibility' alone is the determinant of outcomes for  individuals, as you claim?

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Jan 21^st, 2024 at 11:37am:



Ah --yes; but here's the thing: you claim the 'victimhood industry' is a real thing, while ignoring the real basis of the disadvantage which gives rise to your  misnamed  'victim industry',

Which is really a 'disadvantage industry'; regardless of theories of causation, the disadvantage is real.

And you say it's up to the individual to escape disadvantage, though you appear to admit (below)  personal responsibility isn't the only factor involved in escaping disadvantage - no doubt because you see disadvantage as resulting from (subjective) 'victimhood'.      

Quote:


see above?

Quote:


oh..so I'm NOT ignorant (parrot or otherwise). Thanks.

Quote:


because macroeconomic settings (implemented by government), are as important as personal responsibility for individuals' outcomes. 

Quote:


Ah  - so "choices" , rather than responsibility...

Yes, I see the difference: but the external environment (and maybe genetics)  influences those choices in different ways for different individuals, as numerous studies attest. 

Quote:


It's funny you should claim that - recall my comment above; you see disadvantage as resulting from (subjective) 'victimhood' rather than external circumstances beyond the choices of individuals (but no-one chooses economic recessions).      

Quote:


refuted above, you can't change environments in a global  recession, or tight job market.   

Quote:
 

Good advice, if inadequate; government also has a responsibility to reduce the incidence of dysfunction in families and communities. 


Quote:


Again, only half the story; dysfunctioal families don't exist in isolation from the community around them.

Social workers in the Alice are trying to create circumstances in which individuals in dysfunctional families will make better personal choices, but the government ought also be implemeting policies to reduce the incidence of dysfunction in the first place.

Step 1. replace welfare dependency with paid work.

Step 2. Don't argue over which comes first - the chicken  (responsibility for welfare dependency) or the egg (a job provided by government acting as employer of last resort).
 
Just do it.