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Frank

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Re: foundations
Reply #1035 - Apr 5^th, 2024 at 9:56am

AusGeoff wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 9:47am:

As an aside Frank... serious question...

Why do invariably include a personal insult to someone
every time you post a response to their comments?

Not invariably. Only when they post something evidently stupid. TGD, for example, couldn't post anything that is not stupid. Ditto Smith, gweggy, Bbwian.

You are a hit and miss kinda guy. You can do smart but your heart is really more in the stupid camp with some topics. You are very fond of the self-righteous stupid stuff.

I hope this aswers your question. Don't hesitate to put supplementaries.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: foundations
Reply #1036 - Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:09am

Frank wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 9:43am:

Quote:

I'm railing against law based on the delusion of 'natural individial rights' which don't exist in reality, only in the minds of deluded 'sovereign individual'/"freedom" goons.

This is very stupid, as usual from you. Marxism, 'common prosperity' and all the rest of your silly slogans do not exist in reality either, only in your mind.

The question is: which of the ideas which exist in men's heads can enhance civilization?

'Natural individual rights' in practice are contradictory and therfore nonsense; eg informing the concept of 'legal' war (via 'absolute national sovereignty') which is why endless wars and poverty are the continuing backdrop in human affairs.

Quote:

It will come as a complete surprise and shock to one as stupid as you, but everything, absolutely everything, you know about reality comes mediated by the human mind. There is no unmediated apprehension or apperception. It all comes, first, through the gates of the human senses, then through the filter of the mind and then expressed in an abstract code called language.

The problems arise when the mind is subject to delusions re 'rights', when other individuals decide to enforce their own perceived 'rights' which may conflict with the perceived 'rights'of others.

Quote:

There is no Marxism in reality. It is an ideology, made up fairly recently by a guy whose delusions and vehemence captivated you.

Wrong of course: Marxist thought exists for all to see, unlike 'natural' individual 'rights' which are merely desires of individuals which may well conflict with other individuals' desires.

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: foundations
Reply #1037 - Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:15am

thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 9:33am:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Apr 4^th, 2024 at 5:38pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 4^th, 2024 at 3:55pm:

Quote:

And all those nets the CCP had to place under windows of factories to prevent successful suicides... Common prosperity, CCP style?

Another simple-minded question from a fake "freedom" goon.

Answer: no; the nets were there to prevent suicide.

Common prosperity is a goal.

Ah! Your handler has an Asian mindset - a literal mind.

My question was asked in rhetorical irony.

A literal mind?

Whereas your mind is absent, and can't even begin to deal with the reality of who we are, namely, naturally competitive, self-interested individuals who will go to war 'defending' their own 'shared beliefs'.

Another example of 'the human psychosis'.

Deplorable.

Awww, what's this? "I know I am, but what are you?" ???!!!

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Frank

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Re: foundations
Reply #1038 - Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:16am

Quote:

'Natural individual rights' in practice are contradictory

You have to show the contradiction, not just declare it

Quote:

and therfore nonsense; eg informing the concept of 'legal' war (via 'absolute national sovereignty') which is why endless wars and poverty are the continuing backdrop in human affairs.

This does not follow from the first part of the sentence, parrot. Just sticking a 'therefore' between two clauses does NOT create a logical link.

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 48833 At my desk.	Re: foundations Reply #1039 - Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:18am thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:09am: The question is: which of the ideas which exist in men's heads can enhance civilization? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)_per_capita
Back to top	« Last Edit: Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:28am by freediver » gdp_per_capita.PNG (61 KB \| 6 ) People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words. IP Logged

thegreatdivide

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Re: foundations
Reply #1040 - Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:20am

freediver wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 9:46am:

Quote:

I'm railing against law based on the delusion of 'natural individial rights' which don't exist in reality, only in the minds of deluded 'sovereign individual'/"freedom" goons.

They do not exist in anyone's mind here except yours. It has been pointed out to you countless times that this is merely your own idiotic delusion.

Er... "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal" (obvious nonsense), "that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights,.."

Care to identify these "rights"?

Even the 'right to life and liberty' is cancelled by the 'right' to self defense claimed by Netanyahu, 30,000 dead Palestinians attest to that, in the absence of rule of law out-lawing war.

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freediver

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Re: foundations
Reply #1041 - Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:23am

thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:20am:

freediver wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 9:46am:

Quote:

I'm railing against law based on the delusion of 'natural individial rights' which don't exist in reality, only in the minds of deluded 'sovereign individual'/"freedom" goons.

They do not exist in anyone's mind here except yours. It has been pointed out to you countless times that this is merely your own idiotic delusion.

Er... "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal" (obvious nonsense), "that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights,.."

Care to identify these "rights"?

Even the 'right to life and liberty' is cancelled by the 'right' to self defense claimed by Netanyahu, 30,000 dead Palestinians attest to that, in the absence of rule of law out-lawing war.

Are you quoting anyone here?

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: foundations
Reply #1042 - Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:25am

MeisterEckhart wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:15am:

thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 9:33am:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Apr 4^th, 2024 at 5:38pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 4^th, 2024 at 3:55pm:

Quote:

And all those nets the CCP had to place under windows of factories to prevent successful suicides... Common prosperity, CCP style?

Another simple-minded question from a fake "freedom" goon.

Answer: no; the nets were there to prevent suicide.

Common prosperity is a goal.

Ah! Your handler has an Asian mindset - a literal mind.

My question was asked in rhetorical irony.

A literal mind?

Whereas your mind is absent, and can't even begin to deal with the reality of who we are, namely, naturally competitive, self-interested individuals who will go to war 'defending' their own 'shared beliefs'.

Another example of 'the human psychosis'.

Deplorable.

Awww, what's this? "I know I am, but what are you?" ???!!!

I'm human like you. The difference is I don't subscribe to delusions which result in endless wars and poverty, aka 'the human condition'.

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Frank

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Re: foundations
Reply #1043 - Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:27am

thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 9:40am:

Frank wrote on Apr 4^th, 2024 at 5:26pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 4^th, 2024 at 3:29pm:

Frank wrote on Apr 4^th, 2024 at 9:42am:

thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 4^th, 2024 at 9:37am:

freediver wrote on Apr 3^rd, 2024 at 1:04pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 3^rd, 2024 at 11:45am:

Frank wrote on Apr 2^nd, 2024 at 5:42pm:

And what is the price of expressing dissatisfaction with the CCP?

And what is the price of living in a delusional "natural individuals rights" world?

Would you like to give a straight answer to Frank's question?

Same as the price of contesting the actions of all security spook agencies in any country: severe.

It does depend of the nature of "expressig dissatifaction"; calls for the overthroel of the government are treason in any nation.

A call for a CHANGE of government is NOT a call for the 'overthrow' of it, you stupid parrott, and is not 'treason'.

Oh dear Frank, you've fallen for the "freedom" goons' ideology again.

The CCP IS the government in China; calls to overthrow the CCP are treason.

Just as some want to charge Trump with treason for his attempt to overthrow the elected government in the US.

Quote:

Just try not to go hyperbolic and stupid whenever the shortcomings of communist distatorships is pointed out.

Too much to ask, I know.

Not at all. I'm here to help.

A communist benevolent authority might be very desirable as the democracies - "the worst form of government" - implode under spiralling inequality.

You don't know it - you don't know anything - but your idiotic communist 'benevolent authority' is the commie goons' version of 17-18th century 'enlightened desporism'. Except, of course, enlightened despots respected individual rights and liberties. That was the enlightened bit.

Your error there: enlightened despots require submission to their benevolent authority, overruling delusional and contradictory individual rights.

Quote:

Communists are unenlightened despots.

Depends on the communists in question.

There was more freedom of thought and expression under 18th century Enlightened absolutism than under Chinese communist unenenlightened dictatorship. Voltaire was a great friend of Frederick of Prussia and Catherine the Great was a patron of Diderot.

Any modern day Voltaire or Diderot would be jailed or executed by the CCP.

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: foundations
Reply #1044 - Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:28am

thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:25am:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:15am:

thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 9:33am:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Apr 4^th, 2024 at 5:38pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 4^th, 2024 at 3:55pm:

Quote:

And all those nets the CCP had to place under windows of factories to prevent successful suicides... Common prosperity, CCP style?

Another simple-minded question from a fake "freedom" goon.

Answer: no; the nets were there to prevent suicide.

Common prosperity is a goal.

Ah! Your handler has an Asian mindset - a literal mind.

My question was asked in rhetorical irony.

A literal mind?

Whereas your mind is absent, and can't even begin to deal with the reality of who we are, namely, naturally competitive, self-interested individuals who will go to war 'defending' their own 'shared beliefs'.

Another example of 'the human psychosis'.

Deplorable.

Awww, what's this? "I know I am, but what are you?" ???!!!

I'm human like you. The difference is I don't subscribe to delusions which result in endless wars and poverty, aka 'the human condition'.

You're saying you operate outside the human condition, then... or your handler does.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: foundations
Reply #1045 - Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:29am

Frank wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:16am:

Quote:

'Natural individual rights' in practice are contradictory

You have to show the contradiction, not just declare it

Quote:

and therfore nonsense; eg informing the concept of 'legal' war (via 'absolute national sovereignty') which is why endless wars and poverty are the continuing backdrop in human affairs.

This does not follow from the first part of the sentence, parrot. Just sticking a 'therefore' between two clauses does NOT create a logical link.

Did you miss the example of a contradiction?

The concept of 'legal' war is absurd, because it amounts to legalizing murder.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: foundations
Reply #1046 - Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:31am

freediver wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:23am:

thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:20am:

freediver wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 9:46am:

Quote:

I'm railing against law based on the delusion of 'natural individial rights' which don't exist in reality, only in the minds of deluded 'sovereign individual'/"freedom" goons.

They do not exist in anyone's mind here except yours. It has been pointed out to you countless times that this is merely your own idiotic delusion.

Er... "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal" (obvious nonsense), "that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights,.."

Care to identify these "rights"?

Even the 'right to life and liberty' is cancelled by the 'right' to self defense claimed by Netanyahu, 30,000 dead Palestinians attest to that, in the absence of rule of law out-lawing war.

Are you quoting anyone here?

FD doesn't know the origin of the quoted words?

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freediver

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Re: foundations
Reply #1047 - Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:35am

thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:31am:

freediver wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:23am:

thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:20am:

freediver wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 9:46am:

Quote:

I'm railing against law based on the delusion of 'natural individial rights' which don't exist in reality, only in the minds of deluded 'sovereign individual'/"freedom" goons.

They do not exist in anyone's mind here except yours. It has been pointed out to you countless times that this is merely your own idiotic delusion.

Er... "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal" (obvious nonsense), "that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights,.."

Care to identify these "rights"?

Even the 'right to life and liberty' is cancelled by the 'right' to self defense claimed by Netanyahu, 30,000 dead Palestinians attest to that, in the absence of rule of law out-lawing war.

Are you quoting anyone here?

FD doesn't know the origin of the quoted words?

Would you like to have another go at responding to what I actually posted?

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: foundations
Reply #1048 - Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:41am

MeisterEckhart wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:28am:

thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:25am:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:15am:

thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 9:33am:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Apr 4^th, 2024 at 5:38pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 4^th, 2024 at 3:55pm:

Quote:

And all those nets the CCP had to place under windows of factories to prevent successful suicides... Common prosperity, CCP style?

Another simple-minded question from a fake "freedom" goon.

Answer: no; the nets were there to prevent suicide.

Common prosperity is a goal.

Ah! Your handler has an Asian mindset - a literal mind.

My question was asked in rhetorical irony.

A literal mind?

Whereas your mind is absent, and can't even begin to deal with the reality of who we are, namely, naturally competitive, self-interested individuals who will go to war 'defending' their own 'shared beliefs'.

Another example of 'the human psychosis'.

Deplorable.

Awww, what's this? "I know I am, but what are you?" ???!!!

I'm human like you. The difference is I don't subscribe to delusions which result in endless wars and poverty, aka 'the human condition'.

You're saying you operate outside the human condition, then... or your handler does.

Your error there: mis-interpreting the term "human condition".

In this context the term "the human condition" refers to the endless wars and poverty besetting human affairs, resulting from delusions re 'individual sovereighty' in the human mind.

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freediver

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Re: foundations
Reply #1049 - Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:44am

thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 5^th, 2024 at 10:41am:

Your error there: mis-interpreting the term "human condition".

In this context the term "the human condition" refers to the endless wars and poverty besetting human affairs, resulting from delusions re 'individual sovereighty' in the human mind.

The CCP starved 50 million people to death by trying to feed them all equally. That was not caused by delusions of freedom. It was caused by the stupidity and evil of the CCP.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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