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Grappler Truth Teller Feller Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 82967 Proud pre-1850's NO Voter Gender:	Re: foundations Reply #1215 - Jun 17^th, 2024 at 1:44pm Hamas supporters should all be in Gondwanamo Bay.... you won't need to pack a bag .... your orange overalls will be supplied. Mad people like LTYC don't support anything sane... trolls are like that. Silly senile old bastard - Jew-Hater Nazi .... pass the hat around for a ticket to that one remaining town for the old fool ....
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Laugh till you cry

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Re: foundations
Reply #1216 - Jun 17^th, 2024 at 1:53pm

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Jun 17^th, 2024 at 1:44pm:

Hamas supporters should all be in Gondwanamo Bay.... you won't need to pack a bag .... your orange overalls will be supplied. Mad people like LTYC don't support anything sane... trolls are like that.

Silly senile old bastard - Jew-Hater Nazi .... pass the hat around for a ticket to that one remaining town for the old fool ....

That would be a pleasant change from continuously seeing Grappler's brown-stained caftan.

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Please don't thank me. Effusive fawning and obeisance of disciples, mendicants, and foot-kissers embarrass me.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: foundations
Reply #1217 - Jun 17^th, 2024 at 2:06pm

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Jun 17^th, 2024 at 1:44pm:

Hamas supporters should all be in Gondwanamo Bay.... you won't need to pack a bag .... your orange overalls will be supplied. Mad people like LTYC don't support anything sane... trolls are like that.

Silly senile old bastard - Jew-Hater Nazi .... pass the hat around for a ticket to that one remaining town for the old fool ....

Yes, the old bloke has gone overboard... but Netanyahu, along with Hamas, is being examined for war crimes in the ICC.

Aren't you ashamed to unreservedly support Netanyahu-led Israel?

Like you unreservedly equate 'democratic' citizens' rights with rule of international law - in reality , you reject an effective international rules-based system, for your catastrophic "freedom or death" ideology.

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Grappler Truth Teller Feller

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Re: foundations
Reply #1218 - Jun 17^th, 2024 at 2:16pm

... and the ICC is an unbalanced board not interested in true justice but in pursuing those it chooses to hate... a truly dangerous body that undermines the rules of civilised law by seeking to impose some sort of aggregate of all kinds of 'law'....

Just grand-standing and trying to appear 'fair' and unbiased by chasing both sides regardless of who is the real perpetrator.

Why have they not arrested the original criminals of 7/10? They are in neutral countries and are safe and sound from the fighting - everyone knows where they all are. Why not have those lovie countries arrest and deport them? Why is the UN standing back and wringing its hands while Israel takes out the murderers? If it has such a just and impartial cause - why has it not acted to create peace by ordering Hamas, the original criminals, to surrender and stop the fighting?

Pure grand-standing. Shows the true value of such a body in this modern world. It has no balls and no arms and no morals.... just posturing for benefit, like any and every other political arm.

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams

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thegreatdivide

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Re: foundations
Reply #1219 - Jun 17^th, 2024 at 4:09pm

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Jun 17^th, 2024 at 2:16pm:

... and the ICC is an unbalanced board not interested in true justice but in pursuing those it chooses to hate... a truly dangerous body that undermines the rules of civilised law by seeking to impose some sort of aggregate of all kinds of 'law'....

Thanks for helping us to understand YOUR conception of "justice", ie "civilized law".... which implies the slaughter of children in war is necessary to oppose the actions of the "uncivilized".

Hence the demand for "freedom or death", the ultimate catastrophy for both the "civilized" and "uncivlized", without an effective international rules-based system to judge between subjective claims (like yours) of 'civilizational purity' (compared with the 'enemy'.

"No child's life is worth any less than another's." A. Clooney.... including those in London, Dresden, Hiroshima; and now Israel, Gaza and Ukraine among others.

WHY is war never ending, what are the causes?

The ICJ (and ICC) are in a better position to judge the causes of war, and refer the issue to the UNSC as the peace-keeper (....properly constituted, as per Doc Evatt's original designs), "to save mankind" ...."civilized" and "uncivilized" ..... "from the scourge of war".

Quote:

Just grand-standing and trying to appear 'fair' and unbiased by chasing both sides regardless of who is the real perpetrator.

In my opinion, Israel should never have been recognized by the UN, unless:

1. the UN also recognized the Palestinian State at the same time, as per UN res 181.

and

2. the UNSC could enforce compliance with UN res 181.

Your opinion? I'm prepared to accept the ICJ's opinion, as the arbiter of "civilized justice" ....you?

Quote:

Why have they not arrested the original criminals of 7/10?

Poor graps, asking silly questions revealing the egregious effects of ideological blindness (a FD specialty).

Neither the Oct 7th criminals who murdered 1200 people, nor the IDF criminals who have since murdered 40,000 noncombatants, the majority being women and children, have been arrested, because the ICC doesn't have the machinery to do so.

Quote:

They are in neutral countries and are safe and sound from the fighting - everyone knows where they all are.

No they aren't, and no-one knows (except for the sympathizers sheltering the few who could escape from Gaza without Israel's knowledge). Hamas operatives generally can't leave Gaza.

Quote:

Why not have those lovie countries arrest and deport them? Why is the UN standing back and wringing its hands while Israel takes out the murderers? If it has such a just and impartial cause - why has it not acted to create peace by ordering Hamas, the original criminals, to surrender and stop the fighting?

Because your catastrophic, delusional "I'm civilized you're not"/"freedom or death" ideology still rules the world, not an international rules based system.

Quote:

Pure grand-standing. Shows the true value of such a body in this modern world. It has no balls and no arms and no morals.... just posturing for benefit, like any and every other political arm.

...the result of your ugly, delusional "freedom or death" ideology.

1. Get rid of the UNSC veto.
2. Create an effective international rules-based system to "save mankind from the sourge of war".

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thegreatdivide

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Re: foundations
Reply #1220 - Jun 18^th, 2024 at 12:39pm

Graps indignantly claiming - with zero insight - "no balls and no arms and no morals" (all explained in my previous post #1219).

Do you have ears to hear?

https://www.cantusmusic.net/projects

Top RHS track: "Wo wird in diesen (Jammertal)...":Where in this vale of sorrows will my soul find refuge?

Amid all the cacophany of clashing opinions, this harrowing expression of grief caused by separation from joy.

In memory of the countless children slaughtered in war.

Lord have mercy upon us.

Do you have ears to hear?

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thegreatdivide Gold Member Offline Australian Politics<br /> Posts: 12157 Gender:	Re: foundations Reply #1221 - Jun 25^th, 2024 at 8:44pm Ah - the joys of "fundamental freedoms" via adversarial multi-party politics: Daily Mail headline: Macron warns of civil war if hard-right or hard-left win election
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Gnads

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Re: foundations
Reply #1222 - Jun 26^th, 2024 at 9:40am

Laugh till you cry wrote on Jun 17^th, 2024 at 1:38pm:

Gnads wrote on Jun 7^th, 2024 at 6:51pm:

Laugh till you cry wrote on Jun 1^st, 2024 at 1:11pm:

Israeli Jews violate all those "foundations" in their treatment of Palestinians.

Israeli Jews won't even prosecute Jews who kill other Jews without cause.

Phuk off you terrorist supporting POS

LTYC does not support the terrorist state Israel.

Israel is not a terrorist state. It is surrounded by them.

You support Hamas, Hezbollah terrorists - funded by Iran another terrorist supporting Islamic state. Hezbollah terrorists are using Lebanon to launch rocket attacks into Israel.

The Israelis have every right to defend themselves from all these Jew hating Arabs & Arab countries.

You're one & the same.

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"When you are dead, you do not know you are dead. It's only painful and difficult for others. The same applies when you are stupid." ~ Ricky Gervais

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thegreatdivide

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Re: foundations
Reply #1223 - Jun 26^th, 2024 at 1:17pm

Gnads wrote on Jun 26^th, 2024 at 9:40am:

Laugh till you cry wrote on Jun 17^th, 2024 at 1:38pm:

Gnads wrote on Jun 7^th, 2024 at 6:51pm:

Laugh till you cry wrote on Jun 1^st, 2024 at 1:11pm:

Israeli Jews violate all those "foundations" in their treatment of Palestinians.

Israeli Jews won't even prosecute Jews who kill other Jews without cause.

Phuk off you terrorist supporting POS

LTYC does not support the terrorist state Israel.

Israel is not a terrorist state. It is surrounded by them.

No insight: Israel should not have been recognized by the UN until it had also recognized the Palestinian state, as per UN res 181 (one of the UN's very early resolutions).

Quote:

You support Hamas, Hezbollah terrorists - funded by Iran another terrorist supporting Islamic state. Hezbollah terrorists are using Lebanon to launch rocket attacks into Israel.

No insight: illegal Israeli WB settler-terrorists are killing Palestinians in occupied lands.

Quote:

The Israelis have every right to defend themselves from all these Jew hating Arabs & Arab countries.

Not until Israel recognizes the Palestinian State.

The reason why the Camp David talks failed is RW Jews refuseto countenance sharing of Jerusalem's sovereignty, even though Jerusalem's most iconic building is the Islamic 'Dome of the Rock'.

At least the Oz government now understands recognition of a Palestinian State needs to part of the peace process, not dependent solely on Israeli agreement/acceptance of UN res 181 and 242 - which RW Israeli ideologues will never do: they even stoop to murdering their own PMs who do agree to recognition, hence PM Rabin's fate.

Quote:

You're one & the same.

Nah....you can only see the other side' terrorists, while being blind to your own side's terrorists.

Deplorable.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: foundations
Reply #1224 - Jun 27^th, 2024 at 11:53am

Bobby. wrote on Mar 3^rd, 2024 at 3:54pm:

There are too many topics off the political agenda -
all decided and agreed upon behind closed doors - in secret -
by both major parties.
We never get to vote on it.

True.

And flat-earth economists who have convinced you they know what they are talking about are in large part why the liberal democracies are no longer meeting the needs of the working class, indeed not even affordably housing them.

Then there's the 'security' spooks (ASIO etc) , who are by definition hidden even from governments who are told what to do; eg spend half a trillion on subs and frigates, rather than highspeed trains.

And FD reckons we are "free", because we can vote in elections to replace one set of clowns with another set.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: foundations
Reply #1225 - Jul 1^st, 2024 at 10:00pm

The sad state of affairs of 'the land of the brave and the free' today: Robert F Kennedy Jnr. replying to a MAGA supporter (on X):

While I object to calling human beings “illegals,” something is seriously wrong here. I would go to great lengths to help others, and I respect that impulse enormously. But I see homeless Americans, many of them veterans, in every city I visit in this country, sleeping under freeways in ragged tents, defecating in buckets and begging for food. Obviously that is a complex problem and there is often addiction and mental illness involved, but this young undocumented woman is staying in the posh Roosevelt Hotel for free for two months in NYC with food and expenses paid. And at the end of those months, she simply reapplies for a new hotel room. I’m not blaming her – quite likely, her backstory is filled with hardship and courage. But we should not be housing migrants in five-star hotels while our country is in the midst of a desperate homeless problem and housing affordability crisis. We need to secure the border and bring law and order to immigration.

The outcome of "equality before the law", noted as 'foundational' by FD?

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Gnads

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Re: foundations
Reply #1226 - Jul 2^nd, 2024 at 9:17am

thegreatdivide wrote on Jun 26^th, 2024 at 1:17pm:

Gnads wrote on Jun 26^th, 2024 at 9:40am:

Laugh till you cry wrote on Jun 17^th, 2024 at 1:38pm:

Gnads wrote on Jun 7^th, 2024 at 6:51pm:

Laugh till you cry wrote on Jun 1^st, 2024 at 1:11pm:

Israeli Jews violate all those "foundations" in their treatment of Palestinians.

Israeli Jews won't even prosecute Jews who kill other Jews without cause.

Phuk off you terrorist supporting POS

LTYC does not support the terrorist state Israel.

Israel is not a terrorist state. It is surrounded by them.

No insight: Israel should not have been recognized by the UN until it had also recognized the Palestinian state, as per UN res 181 (one of the UN's very early resolutions).

Quote:

You support Hamas, Hezbollah terrorists - funded by Iran another terrorist supporting Islamic state. Hezbollah terrorists are using Lebanon to launch rocket attacks into Israel.

No insight: illegal Israeli WB settler-terrorists are killing Palestinians in occupied lands.

Quote:

The Israelis have every right to defend themselves from all these Jew hating Arabs & Arab countries.

Not until Israel recognizes the Palestinian State.

The reason why the Camp David talks failed is RW Jews refuseto countenance sharing of Jerusalem's sovereignty, even though Jerusalem's most iconic building is the Islamic 'Dome of the Rock'.

At least the Oz government now understands recognition of a Palestinian State needs to part of the peace process, not dependent solely on Israeli agreement/acceptance of UN res 181 and 242 - which RW Israeli ideologues will never do: they even stoop to murdering their own PMs who do agree to recognition, hence PM Rabin's fate.

Quote:

You're one & the same.

Nah....you can only see the other side' terrorists, while being blind to your own side's terrorists.

Deplorable.

Rubbish ... you terrorist supporting crud.

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"When you are dead, you do not know you are dead. It's only painful and difficult for others. The same applies when you are stupid." ~ Ricky Gervais

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thegreatdivide

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Re: foundations
Reply #1227 - Jul 2^nd, 2024 at 1:01pm

Gnads wrote on Jul 2^nd, 2024 at 9:17am:

thegreatdivide wrote on Jun 26^th, 2024 at 1:17pm:

Gnads wrote on Jun 26^th, 2024 at 9:40am:

Laugh till you cry wrote on Jun 17^th, 2024 at 1:38pm:

Gnads wrote on Jun 7^th, 2024 at 6:51pm:

Laugh till you cry wrote on Jun 1^st, 2024 at 1:11pm:

Israeli Jews violate all those "foundations" in their treatment of Palestinians.

Israeli Jews won't even prosecute Jews who kill other Jews without cause.

Phuk off you terrorist supporting POS

LTYC does not support the terrorist state Israel.

Israel is not a terrorist state. It is surrounded by them.

No insight: Israel should not have been recognized by the UN until it had also recognized the Palestinian state, as per UN res 181 (one of the UN's very early resolutions).

Quote:

You support Hamas, Hezbollah terrorists - funded by Iran another terrorist supporting Islamic state. Hezbollah terrorists are using Lebanon to launch rocket attacks into Israel.

No insight: illegal Israeli WB settler-terrorists are killing Palestinians in occupied lands.

Quote:

The Israelis have every right to defend themselves from all these Jew hating Arabs & Arab countries.

Not until Israel recognizes the Palestinian State.

The reason why the Camp David talks failed is RW Jews refuseto countenance sharing of Jerusalem's sovereignty, even though Jerusalem's most iconic building is the Islamic 'Dome of the Rock'.

At least the Oz government now understands recognition of a Palestinian State needs to part of the peace process, not dependent solely on Israeli agreement/acceptance of UN res 181 and 242 - which RW Israeli ideologues will never do: they even stoop to murdering their own PMs who do agree to recognition, hence PM Rabin's fate.

Quote:

You're one & the same.

Nah....you can only see the other side' terrorists, while being blind to your own side's terrorists.

Deplorable.

Rubbish ... you terrorist supporting crud.

Er....Netanyahu's goons refuse to countenance a Palestinian state with East Jerusalem as its capital.

They are responsible for Hamas' terrorism.

And UN incompetence: Palestine should have been recoginized when Israel was recognized, in 1947.

Senator Payman is correct: the two major parties are complicit in the endless war and the present ongoing genocide.

The UN needs to recognize Palestine NOW, as per UN res 242, and lock up the recalcitrants on either side.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: foundations
Reply #1228 - Jul 14^th, 2024 at 6:09pm

A fitting day, perhaps, to look at the foundations of Trump's program if he wins office in November.

https://www.rawstory.com/trump-project-2025-2666261099/?utm_source=msn

Analysis exposes Trumpian Project 2025: 'Far-right playbook for American authoritarianism'

As former Republican U.S. President Donald Trump campaigns with openly fascist rhetoric, a research and advocacy group on Monday published an exposé of the
Heritage Foundation-led 2025 Presidential Transition Project
.

Project 2025, as it is also known, builds on Heritage's latest Mandate for Leadership, a series which since the Reagan administration has served as the right-wing think tank's to-do list for the next Republican president.

The Global Project Against Hate and Extremism (GPAHE) put out a detailed analysis of
Project 2025
, which the group described as a "far-right playbook for American authoritarianism" and "a threat to a multiracial, diverse democracy."

"Project 2025 is an authoritarian roadmap to dismantling a thriving, inclusive democracy for all."

Across 13 sections, the GPAHE report introduces the project, explains the role of Christian nationalism, and details efforts to gut the civil service, reverse progress on racial equality, eviscerate LGBTQ+ rights, restrict reproductive freedom, impose hardline immigration rules, roll back climate action, end "woke" military policies, overhaul public education, and curb human rights.

The analysis also features a full list of organizational supporters and profiles of key backers, including the Family Research Council, Heartland Institute, Moms for Liberty, and Turning Point USA.

"Project 2025 paints progressives and liberals as outside acceptable politics, and not just ideological opponents, but inherently anti-American and 'replacing American values.' Targeting vulnerable communities is a core tenet of Project 2025."

"Project 2025 is very clearly on a path to Christian nationalism as well as authoritarianism. It rejects the constitutional separation of church and state, rather privileging religious beliefs over civil laws. Religious freedom is referenced throughout the plan and is seen to trump all other civil rights which should be subsumed to an individual's religious rights," the report adds. "The message that America must remain Christian, that Christianity should enjoy a privileged place in society, and that the government must take steps to ensure this is clear in every section of the plan, as is the idea that American identity cannot be separated from Christianity."

Hmm... we get the picture - a return to pre-enlightenment Christian fundamentalism.

Not a good foundation for a modern multi-cultural state.

Though I suppose we can be thankful God (?) saved Trump today, as his RW Christian supporters are claiming ......whereas Hitler was also saved from Georg Elser’s Beer Hall Bomb in 1939 (one of the early native German attempts on Hitler's life)......destiny?

But what of "shared beliefs"and "subjective reality"

Ouch - we need to go back to the drawing board.... to ascertain a clearer picture of objective reality. i

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thegreatdivide

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Re: foundations
Reply #1229 - Jul 15^th, 2024 at 1:49pm

Apparently Trump was heard shouting "fight, fight, fight" while raising his fists, with blood streaming on his face.

He's certainly fearless; but a few hour later, realizing the current potential for civil war in the US, he backtracked a bit and fell into line with Biden's mainstream message: "there is no place for political violence in the US."

Something wrong with our political/economic foundations.

Why can't we all, through our governments, enjoy reasonable above-poverty participation in the economy?

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