Australian Politics Forum - Looking back on Mungo Man

Gnads

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Re: Looking back on Mungo Man
Reply #45 - Mar 11^th, 2024 at 8:22am

Jasin wrote on Mar 11^th, 2024 at 7:07am:

The more admixture in a race, the more robust against such things as diseases, it is and the more adaptable to conditions and changes it is.
The San in southern Africa have the greatest genetic diversity due to admixture 'through time' than any other people's by a good percentage. They have both modern admixtures and ancient DNA's that are now lost to nearly all of the races of today.
If an ancient virus (for hypothetical reasoning) was dug up in the Siberian permafrosts melting that modern races have no immunity against, the San at least will still have the genetic coding to be immune from it.

Kalahari Bushmen .... not immune to being hit in the head with a coke bottle thrown from 300o ft out of a plane. Grin

As to be immune from ancient pathogens locked in the permafrost ... pure speculation.

Isolation from diseases - like pre-colonial Aboriginals - was what has prevented illness.

Ask the modern activist Aboriginals ... they're still blaming colonisation for bringing diseases as one of their victim card endorsements.

Like as if they would have still been in isolation some 235 years later had the British not claimed the place.

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AusGeoff

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Re: Looking back on Mungo Man
Reply #46 - Mar 11^th, 2024 at 8:28am

Researchers have found ancient watering holes that were long ago
buried by rising seas. The watering holes may be ones referred to in an
Indigenous Australian songline.

Ancient Indigenous ‘Songlines’ Match Long-Sunken Landscape off Australia.

Marine geologist Mick O’Leary says that although the research team did
not physically follow the songline to make its discovery, he thinks that
kind of collaboration might happen in the near future. "We really see now
you need to weave together the Western science and Indigenous
knowledge, braid it together, so it’s not done as two separate things",
he says. "When these things are overlaid together, you get a more holistic
picture of Sea Country".

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chimera

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Re: Looking back on Mungo Man
Reply #47 - Mar 11^th, 2024 at 8:37am

'This suggests that the songline may have been created more than 7,000 years ago, when the sea level was far lower—and the area with the watering holes was dry and more than 100 kilometers inland'.
A bit different from 25000 years. By the wording, maybe the holes were used later than 7000. That becomes more credible. One Sth Aust legend is declared to be 11000 years old.. yeah..how is that dated?

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Frank

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Re: Looking back on Mungo Man
Reply #48 - Mar 11^th, 2024 at 8:38am

AusGeoff wrote on Mar 11^th, 2024 at 8:28am:

Researchers have found ancient watering holes that were long ago
buried by rising seas. The watering holes may be ones referred to in an
Indigenous Australian songline.

Ancient Indigenous ‘Songlines’ Match Long-Sunken Landscape off Australia.

Marine geologist Mick O’Leary says that although the research team did
not physically follow the songline to make its discovery, he thinks that
kind of collaboration might happen in the near future. "We really see now
you need to weave together the Western science and Indigenous
knowledge, braid it together, so it’s not done as two separate things",
he says. "When these things are overlaid together, you get a more holistic
picture of Sea Country".

The Old Norse Sagas, Kalevala, the Bible, Mahabharata etc are all ancient 'songlines' , so let's braid them all together with Science to get the holistic picture.

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: Looking back on Mungo Man
Reply #49 - Mar 11^th, 2024 at 9:44am

Gnads wrote on Mar 11^th, 2024 at 8:04am:

Why do Aboriginals think he is one of theirs? or has any connection historically, genetically, traditionally or culturally??

The obvious reason is that all peoples who migrated in waves into Australia are, by definition, aboriginal.

Each successive wave does not necessarily have to be genetically related to a previous one to qualify as aboriginal.

Given these waves were likely to be separated from each other by thousands of years, it is improbable that they were directly related to each other.

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chimera Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 10835 armidale Gender:	Re: Looking back on Mungo Man Reply #50 - Mar 11^th, 2024 at 10:55am But his descendants would be fully Aboriginal whichever groups inter married. And his ethnic group would continue on as normally spreading outwards and onwards. It's like all the lines in UK from the stone age to recent centuries which now are mixed and so are related at the large scale.
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Gnads

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Re: Looking back on Mungo Man
Reply #51 - Mar 11^th, 2024 at 11:10am

MeisterEckhart wrote on Mar 11^th, 2024 at 9:44am:

Gnads wrote on Mar 11^th, 2024 at 8:04am:

Why do Aboriginals think he is one of theirs? or has any connection historically, genetically, traditionally or culturally??

The obvious reason is that all peoples who migrated in waves into Australia are, by definition, aboriginal.

Each successive wave does not necessarily have to be genetically related to a previous one to qualify as aboriginal.

Given these waves were likely to be separated from each other by thousands of years, it is improbable that they were directly related to each other.

That's the inference I was making.

As far as qualifying as Aboriginals ... my ancestors migrated here too. 174 years ago.

Know what I mean? Wink

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"When you are dead, you do not know you are dead. It's only painful and difficult for others. The same applies when you are stupid." ~ Ricky Gervais

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chimera Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 10835 armidale Gender:	Re: Looking back on Mungo Man Reply #52 - Mar 11^th, 2024 at 11:26am No That's too recent on the large scale. We need a beige coffee with chocolate flakes.
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Baronvonrort

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Re: Looking back on Mungo Man
Reply #53 - Mar 11^th, 2024 at 3:59pm

Brian Ross wrote on Mar 10^th, 2024 at 3:39pm:

Looking back on Mungo Man – human remains millennia older than the pyramids – 50 years on - his discovery changed everything we knew about Indigenous Australians - for the better.

The Egyptians built the Pyramids around 5000 years ago.

The best the Aborigines could do in 40,000 years is a bark hut.

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Jasin

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Re: Looking back on Mungo Man
Reply #54 - Mar 11^th, 2024 at 4:18pm

Gnads wrote on Mar 11^th, 2024 at 8:22am:

Jasin wrote on Mar 11^th, 2024 at 7:07am:

The more admixture in a race, the more robust against such things as diseases, it is and the more adaptable to conditions and changes it is.
The San in southern Africa have the greatest genetic diversity due to admixture 'through time' than any other people's by a good percentage. They have both modern admixtures and ancient DNA's that are now lost to nearly all of the races of today.
If an ancient virus (for hypothetical reasoning) was dug up in the Siberian permafrosts melting that modern races have no immunity against, the San at least will still have the genetic coding to be immune from it.

Kalahari Bushmen .... not immune to being hit in the head with a coke bottle thrown from 300o ft out of a plane. Grin

As to be immune from ancient pathogens locked in the permafrost ... pure speculation.

Isolation from diseases - like pre-colonial Aboriginals - was what has prevented illness.

Ask the modern activist Aboriginals ... they're still blaming colonisation for bringing diseases as one of their victim card endorsements.

Like as if they would have still been in isolation some 235 years later had the British not claimed the place.

I'll give you that one as well. You're running hot of late Gonads.

Aborigines, are different to the San as they were 'isolated' by 'island fever' - hence why they slowly became sterile so to speak.
The San on the other hand still inhabited a continent that was till joined to the other Old Worlds of Mid-East, Asia & Europe. The latest trend in new diseases would have reached them as well to boost up their eventual immunity.
But they would be far more adaptive to any 'older' virus that re-emerged, while the 'much' younger Haplogroups would not.

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Jasin

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Re: Looking back on Mungo Man
Reply #55 - Mar 11^th, 2024 at 4:23pm

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 11^th, 2024 at 3:59pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Mar 10^th, 2024 at 3:39pm:

Looking back on Mungo Man – human remains millennia older than the pyramids – 50 years on - his discovery changed everything we knew about Indigenous Australians - for the better.

The Egyptians built the Pyramids around 5000 years ago.

The best the Aborigines could do in 40,000 years is a bark hut.

The Egyptians were only able to do such things 5,000 years ago because they were not in a situation of 'sensory deprivation' from 'isolation'. They were still influenced from other parts of the Middle-East, even from across the Mediterranean Sea and so on. Such 'stimulants' cause 'change'.

The Aborigines were out in front one day, then they were cut off and they basically stopped where they were, while the rest of the world eventually caught up and them on by. The fact that the rest of the world didn't change much since Sapien entry into Australia - for such a long time says a lot too!

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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.

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Brian Ross

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Re: Looking back on Mungo Man
Reply #56 - Mar 11^th, 2024 at 4:51pm

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 11^th, 2024 at 3:59pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Mar 10^th, 2024 at 3:39pm:

Looking back on Mungo Man – human remains millennia older than the pyramids – 50 years on - his discovery changed everything we knew about Indigenous Australians - for the better.

The Egyptians built the Pyramids around 5000 years ago.

The best the Aborigines could do in 40,000 years is a bark hut.

*SIGH* there is evidence that Indigenous Australians once lived in Stone Huts. The idea that they have been nomadic all their existence is old hat. The climate of Australia was once much wetter and supported Aquaculture and Agriculture. Please, acquaint yourself with modern Archeology, Baron. Your Racism is showing too clearly to be of much use. Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

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Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour. Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe? Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

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Frank

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Re: Looking back on Mungo Man
Reply #57 - Mar 11^th, 2024 at 5:07pm

Brian Ross wrote on Mar 11^th, 2024 at 4:51pm:

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 11^th, 2024 at 3:59pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Mar 10^th, 2024 at 3:39pm:

Looking back on Mungo Man – human remains millennia older than the pyramids – 50 years on - his discovery changed everything we knew about Indigenous Australians - for the better.

The Egyptians built the Pyramids around 5000 years ago.

The best the Aborigines could do in 40,000 years is a bark hut.

*SIGH* there is evidence that Indigenous Australians once lived in Stone Huts. The idea that they have been nomadic all their existence is old hat. The climate of Australia was once much wetter and supported Aquaculture and Agriculture. Please, acquaint yourself with modern Archeology, Baron. Your Racism is showing too clearly to be of much use. Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

Is that from Pascoe?

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: Looking back on Mungo Man
Reply #58 - Mar 11^th, 2024 at 6:10pm

If there was an Australian Aboriginal culture that included the creation of permanent dwellings, there would be ample evidence of it in the southern parts of Australia and Tasmania.

That some central western Aboriginals did just that and cultivated root vegetables shocked the early explorers of the region as it was unknown in every other region of Australia.

However, those Aboriginals who built and maintained those permanent settlements were also physiologically different in appearance to all other Aboriginal peoples everywhere and it is now believed that they were descendants of Dutch sailors who were known to have been marooned in the region nearly 200 years before.

Also, had they practised farming at all, evidence of the farming of kangaroos likely would be everywhere.

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Grappler Truth Teller Feller

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Re: Looking back on Mungo Man
Reply #59 - Mar 11^th, 2024 at 6:10pm

Frank wrote on Mar 11^th, 2024 at 5:07pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Mar 11^th, 2024 at 4:51pm:

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 11^th, 2024 at 3:59pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Mar 10^th, 2024 at 3:39pm:

Looking back on Mungo Man – human remains millennia older than the pyramids – 50 years on - his discovery changed everything we knew about Indigenous Australians - for the better.

The Egyptians built the Pyramids around 5000 years ago.

The best the Aborigines could do in 40,000 years is a bark hut.

*SIGH* there is evidence that Indigenous Australians once lived in Stone Huts. The idea that they have been nomadic all their existence is old hat. The climate of Australia was once much wetter and supported Aquaculture and Agriculture. Please, acquaint yourself with modern Archeology, Baron. Your Racism is showing too clearly to be of much use. Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

Is that from Pascoe?

The capitals on Agriculture and Aquaculture show this to be Pascoeitis. You can take it as racist bullshit without a second look.

Stone huts, you say? Well - one lot settled at Bermagui half the year then went up to the Snowies the other half... had a few fish traps ... no evidence of any 'agriculture' though... bit of gathering of native stuff is not agriculture... they must have had shelters at Bermagui - so what? So what if they piled up a few stones and put a twig roof over it for winter, where the winds blow cold down there?

So they didn't wander 24/7/365 - maybe hunkered down in winter where it was a bit warmer and there were fish for the trap etc... doesn't change the nature of their 'culture'.

As much chance as my kid's cousin winning an Oscar for Best Director.... oh - wait - he did - for Oppenheimer! Wish the old girl had said - "You'll cop the best blowie when some family member wins an Oscar...."

Pascoe has had years now to 'grow his native crops' in a perfect situation, and hasn't managed it yet...

Be great to be looking back on Mungo Man as a fine joke.... tell you what - let's get a court order, collect some DNA from him, see if the local Keffir match in any way - and if not - they STFU about their fabled 'heritage'.

Deal?? Jesus - that old and he could be the ancestor of some monkey......

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« Last Edit: Mar 11^th, 2024 at 6:22pm by Grappler Truth Teller Feller »

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