freediver wrote on Feb 13^th, 2025 at 7:46am:


Bit by bit, you change your dumb question to accomodate what I have taught you....progress of sorts 

Now it's become: whose fault was it when commies fought to replace privilege with common prosperity?

Employing the erroneous RW 'personal responsibility' mantra - erroneous because individuals - even if 'responsible' -  can't overcome the egregious effect of a dysfunctional macroeconomic  environment. 

Even the world's most powerful individual, Trump (whether "responsible" or not),  is currently thrashing around trying to 'MAGA', in a dysfunctional global economy. 

freediver wrote on Feb 14^th, 2025 at 8:08am:



Wrong of course: "millions of farmers", forming the vast majority in China's  pre-industrial subsistence agriculture economy,  were living in absolute poverty;  they were victims of the status quo, not supporters of it.

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Wrong of course; the communist might in fact create an economy which works for all, since that is his goal.

Hence  the CCP was responsible for the "Chinese miracle" (fastest eradication of poverty in history) because that has remained  the CCP's  goal.

China put in a policy for its people to kill sparrows (of whom only eat a small portion of crop as diet) and other critters.
The lack of sparrows who prey on Locusts, led to the Locust proliferation which devoured all crops. Thus famine.

freediver wrote on Feb 16^th, 2025 at 3:02pm:


Please give an actual example of this, from the post to which you imagine you are replying.

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Again: example(s) please, with reference to my actual post.

Then maybe yu can progress YOUR point.

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Probably not - most civilizations never approached that population size in history. 

But note: "trying to help" is much better in the long run than defending the status quo in which poverty is maintained by a privileged aristocracy - or in this case,  greedy Nationalist capitalists. 

eg  commies believed the fastest way to eradicate poverty in a huge poverty-stricken subsistence-farming population was to industrialize using Marxist teachings...but greedy capitalists resisted the idea of a communist government, ofcourse.  Hence the civil war.

But a comparison of India with China is very imformative; today India's vast rural unwashed (c.700 million people), still living in absolute poverty, remain ignorant, superstitious peasants (hence their susceptibility to all the current divisive crap re 'Hindu nationalism' pushed by no less than Modi), while China's educated rural poor can now afford tickets to access the world's largest HS rail network.
.......

Speaking of "propaganda": it's in the eye of the beholder.

eg, consider the latest assertion, by delusional "democracy=freedom" ideologues,   that "Taiwan has never been ruled by the CCP".
True enough, BUT  - Taiwan has NEVER been  an independent nation either, while the Qing dynasty did in fact rule Taiwan for 3 centuries. 

..and look at the 'flows of history' re Taiwan; in the 1970s when the US wanted to cosy up to China as a bulwark against the 'threat' from the mighty communist USSR, they refused to recognize Taiwan as an independent nation, falling into line with the UN. But now the tables have turned: China is now a much greater  "threat", and so Trump is cosying up to Putin at Zelensky's expense, reversing Kissinger's efforts to establish a rapport with China.  Too funny to watch the current distress in the world's capitals,  in the face of Trump's 'transactional' style.  (Apperently Zelensky offended Trump by refusing to hand over Ukraine's 'rare-earths' to the US.


"Oh, the tangled-webs we weave"....

freediver wrote on Feb 20^th, 2025 at 3:26pm:


Your error: there were not "tens of millions"  of Chinese who were NOT living in absolute poverty, in China's pre-industrial economy in which the vast majoriy WERE subsistence farmers. 

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Your error: the G_L_F was AFTER Mao achieved power, we are discussing the CAUSES of the Marxist revolution in China.

Mistakes were made after the communist victory, but in the long run ......would you prefer to be a rural peasant living in China or India today - with the former having at least 5 times the per capita gdp cf the latter, and taking account of the much better rural infrastructure in China?

And: (google)

"According to recent data, life expectancy in China is significantly higher than in India; with China having a life expectancy around 79 years (edit: in fact higher than in the US, where greedy health insurance bosses are likely to be executed by disgruntled citizens..), while India's is around 68 years, meaning people in China live on average about 11 years longer than people in India. "

Not to mention life in the big cities; now Beijing has good air quality on most days, in New Dehli - god help us...

And India's average life expectency  is EVEN LOWER than for Oz's aboriginals  - you get the picture re India's rural poor.....

Meanwhile ...love Trump cosying up to Putin against Zelensky, don't you?

"Democratic freedoms",  you see.....

Despite the fact "democratic" Taiwan has never been an independent country...oh the joys of Western propaganda. 


 

lee wrote on Feb 20^th, 2025 at 4:19pm:


Ah...crippled-brain lee shows up.

FD claimed he did not say "millions of farmers", but "tens of millions"  of - who, exactly?

China's pre-industrial population was mostly a poverty-stricken, subsistence-agriculture population, in the poorest nation on the planet.   

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Are you back to saying the CCP did not slaughter tens of millions of Chinese people? You never did give a straight answer on that.

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 21^st, 2025 at 10:40am:


So the 50 or so million people who starved to death under Mao prove that the CCP was right to slaughter 20 or 30 million Chinese people to get into power and inflict communism on the people?

All those deaths were worth it so that 100 years later a bunch of ignorant little pinks could get a 5 second ego trip by deluding themselves into thinking that by lurching towards capitalism, and achieving a median wage that is less than half of our unemployment benefits, "free enterprise" would shake in its boots. You must really hate freedom if you are willing to kill so many Chinese people on the altar of communism.

Thanks for buying all our coal and iron ore by the way.