Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Oct 20^th, 2024 at 10:14am:


Why is it that I'm always answering your questions and you're always weaselling out of mine, even when they're so benign as to simply be asking you for your opinion on the very news article you posted?

Fool me once.

And we've been over reconciliation before, but you just ignored it.  So now I have to repeat myself?

How many times am I going to have to repeat?

And you won't come to the table and answer my questions, and even edit them out of your quotes entirely?

Discussion requires give and take, not demanding things you're only going to ignore, while only looking for a gotcha that will never come.

I don't think it's unreasonable to post these questions to you,

SadKangaroo wrote on Oct 20^th, 2024 at 7:51am:


What are you so afraid of?

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Oct 21^st, 2024 at 11:30am:


Firstly, we'll see if you can be trusted, I highly doubt it but here we go anyway.  I'm borrowing greatly from my last post where I went through my thoughts on the topic in detail, only to have it ignored or cherry-picked at the time.

I'm also making the assumption that you are in fact looking for more than a one liner, and a genuine response to the question.  Again, I remain sceptical, but we'll see what happens.

I am no expert in the area, but I do know our history, what was done to the Indigenous population during colonisation and since, and while I've only lived in the NT for about 8 months when I was driving tour buses as a way to gain experience to move into the Mining Industry, a past life then never panned out, it was an eye opening experience.

I am not a scholar on this subject and have limited personal experience.  This is why I have let my opinions be guided by those who are, and have more experience than me.

They have suggested that the goal of reconciliation is to address the historical injustices, ongoing disparities, and cultural insensitivities faced by Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples since colonisation, this statement is one that resonates with me.

The best way to achieve this they suggest, is through the following framework, especially since The Voice failed:

Historical Acknowledgment and Truth-Telling

Official Apologies and Acknowledgments: Sincere, nationwide acknowledgments of past wrongdoings, including the Stolen Generations, forced labor, land theft, and cultural suppression.

Truth and Reconciliation Commission: Establishing a commission to document and publicly disclose the full extent of historical injustices, providing a platform for survivors to share their stories.

Cultural Recognition and Preservation

Constitutional Recognition: Incorporating Indigenous Australians into the Constitution, acknowledging their prior ownership and ongoing connection to the land.

Preservation of Languages and Cultures: Government-supported programs to revive, teach, and promote Indigenous languages and cultural practices.

Indigenous Representation in Media and Education: Inclusive representation in media, and integration of Indigenous histories and perspectives into the national curriculum.

Land Rights and Self-Determination

Expanded Land Rights and Native Title: Strengthening and expanding land rights to ensure greater control over traditional lands, including the right to manage and protect sacred sites.

Self-Governance and Decision-Making Power: Empowering Indigenous communities with autonomy to make decisions over their lands, services, and futures.

Health and Wellbeing Parity

Targeted Healthcare Initiatives: Programs addressing the significant gaps in health outcomes, including higher rates of chronic disease, lower life expectancy, and poor mental health.

Access to Clean Water, Housing, and Sanitation: Ensuring basic human rights are met in all Indigenous communities.

Economic Empowerment

Employment and Education Initiatives: Tailored programs to increase Indigenous employment rates, educational attainment, and economic participation.

Support for Indigenous-Owned Businesses: Financial and regulatory support to foster entrepreneurship and economic self-sufficiency.

Justice and Incarceration Reform

Reducing Incarceration Rates: Implementing alternative justice models and rehabilitation programs to address the disproportionate representation of Indigenous Australians in the prison system.

Royal Commission into Indigenous Incarceration: Investigating the root causes and recommending systemic reforms.

Community-Led Reconciliation Initiatives

Grassroots Reconciliation Programs: Funding and supporting community-driven projects that foster cross-cultural understanding and reconciliation.

Indigenous-Led Solutions: Prioritising Indigenous voices and leadership in the development and implementation of reconciliation strategies.

On paper, this all sounds great, but it will not work without the leaders in their communities driving the charge and, through more options for self-determination, also expecting more of their community members.

Without this, none of the above will make a difference.  They need to be included in the process and want to put in the work to achieve the outcome.

There will also, sadly, need to be extra bureaucratic measures in place to monitor, report and administer the vast amounts of funds that will need to be injected into making this a reality, costing even more than will directly benefit the people, but every dollar will need to be accounted for, and that isn't free.

It is a shame that the Voice was rejected by the people, but Labor and those who support the Uluru Statement, especially those like Labor who took it to the last election, should continue working towards that end.

Grap, if you'd be so kind as to answer my questions in return, it would be appreciated.

Now do yourself a favour - post your concepts one at a time - once the page runs out I just stop bothering responding to your endless monologue.

You are fundamentally wrong about all of the things you've mentioned, in many, many ways.

In short - again - Aborigine - Heal Thyself!  Get out of the past, stop clinging to a lost delusion of an idyll in the warm sun, and get on with life.

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Oct 21^st, 2024 at 1:34pm:


Instead of piling on more demands, if you think I’m wrong, have the courage to articulate why, and let’s debate like adults.

If you’ve got better alternatives, don’t just hint at them, lay them out.

Or is this whole facade just your way of sulking because you didn’t get what you wanted from my post? If you’re done playing this tiresome game, just say so.

But if you’ve got any intellectual stamina left, I’m more than willing to continue.

I’m actually interested in your insights on the issue. So far, all you’ve offered are thinly veiled, bigoted dismissals. Surely, you can do better than that, or is this the full extent of your reasoning?

MeisterEckhart wrote on Oct 21^st, 2024 at 2:36pm:


No.  It is for an independent, balanced, and neutral body to determine the facts as far as possible ... simple grievance holding is not the answer.

Look at the narrative of 'massacres' 'driven off the land' etc.... in the very vast majority of cases, any 'massacres' were in response to murders and stock killings and such ... if they were in fact 'driven off the land' why are they still there?  Answer:- those who lived in peace remained... those who chose not to received the same in return.

How come so much of some of the primest land in Sydney - South Maroubra and down to the foreshores - is Aboriginal land from which many great people - the Ella brothers etc - have come?  Were they 'driven off'?

Nah - nah - they was all massacred and then driven off ..... true story....

There's a point at which fireside embellishments have to be called out... the 'Appin Massacre' 1816 - killed 14 men in arms ... those 14 men had murdered 16 Whites including unarmed men and unarmed and defenceless women and children.... their women and children were not killed.... yet their descendants still cry about their ancestor being taken under protection in a fight to the death, and removed to a place of safety - from which they remained in the gene pool to even produce their descendants who cry about it today, over two hundred falcon years later!

If I went back to 1816 I'd have grievance against the Danish, Scottish, Irish, English and German governments.... FFS.

Got that?  What 'reconciliation' is owed to that crying descendant who lives comfortably in a house and is interviewed over a cup of tea with biscuits in a peaceful home environment?  What 'reconciliation' is owed to the likes of Ray Martin and Stan Grant (both of whom I never noticed to be Aboriginal until they 'came out' - simply didn't matter to me - yet some of you scum yell 'racist' at me while drowning in your Deep Real Racism against Australia that nurtures you) and any number of others who have done very well, thank you, out of our society and culture?

Why would reconciliation be owed to some asshole who steals his/her tribe's royalty money (etc) and uses it for self, mates and family?  Best you turn him/her over to village justice!!

You lost souls...........                                    

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Oct 21^st, 2024 at 3:03pm:


Why do you think that?

SadKangaroo wrote on Oct 21^st, 2024 at 1:47pm:


.. except you never even respond to a single one of those.....

Now then - how's your homework going?  You know - don't crowd your page with too many issues to answer at one time and then whine that others won't respond to you.

Start again - which one of your copy and pastes do you wish to be responded to first?  One at a time..

Footnote - in the Indian heron user's community - they call it poppy and caste...