Australian Politics Forum - How Trump could overturn the 2024 election

thegreatdivide

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Re: How Trump could overturn the 2024 election
Reply #15 - Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:24am

Armchair_Politician wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 9:53am:

Laws vary from state to state, in some cases from one county to the next. There is no central organisation to oversee the election like we have here in the Australian Electoral Commission. Our system ensures a level playing field nation-wide, something sorely lacking in the US.

Yes; the US was created at a time when the enlightenment posited the concept of 'natural individual rights' (a delusion), which became all the rage in the US colonies, in reaction to the 'divine right of Kings' (the pre-existing delusion).

So centralized government was an anathema to the 13 states who formed the US.

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Panther

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Re: How Trump could overturn the 2024 election
Reply #16 - Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:27am

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 8:33am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 3^rd, 2024 at 2:03pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 3^rd, 2024 at 1:32pm:

— He will lean on friendly county and state officials to resist certifying election results — a futile errand that would nevertheless fuel a campaign to put pressure on elected Republican legislators in statehouses and Congress.

— He will call on allies in GOP-controlled swing-state legislatures to appoint “alternate” presidential electors.

— He will try to ensure Harris is denied 270 votes in the Electoral College, sending the election to the House, where Republicans are likely to have the numbers to choose Trump as the next president.

Excellent Point!

Even though, in my opinion the point will be moot, there are 538 Electors for this election. If either candidate reaches 270, then only 268 would remain. If memory serves me well, there were a total of 10 'faithless' electors in 2016.

So then failure of either or both candidates to get to the almighty 270, the House will determine the winner.

As I've stated, I believe the point will be moot being the winner will get 270+.

I know who I voted for.

We will see what we will see when all the dust settles post election.

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« Last Edit: Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:38am by Panther »

"When the People fear government there is Tyranny;
When government fears the People there is Freedom & Liberty!"

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thegreatdivide

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Re: How Trump could overturn the 2024 election
Reply #17 - Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:33am

Panther wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:27am:

"When the People fear government there is Tyranny;
When government fears the People there is Freedom & Liberty!"

Just to educate you:

The US was created at a time when the enlightenment posited the concept of 'natural individual rights' (a delusion), which became all the rage in the US colonies, in reaction to the 'divine right of Kings' (the pre-existing delusion).

So centralized government was an anathema to the 13 states who formed the US.

"For all to be free, all must submit to rule of law". Cicero.

That includes you, Panther.

It's ironic Trump "wants to be a dictator -at least on day one...."

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greggerypeccary Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 136341 Gender:	Re: How Trump could overturn the 2024 election Reply #18 - Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:37am Panther wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:27am: I know who I voted for. A rapist and convicted felon?
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Panther Gold Member Offline My Heart beats True for the Red White & Blue... Posts: 11350 Gender:	Re: How Trump could overturn the 2024 election Reply #19 - Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:42am greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:37am: Panther wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:27am: I know who I voted for. A rapist and convicted felon? You said it, I didn't......
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thegreatdivide Gold Member Offline Australian Politics<br /> Posts: 12439 Gender:	Re: How Trump could overturn the 2024 election Reply #20 - Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:45am Panther wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:42am: You said it, I didn't...... The law said it....
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Bobby. Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 102840 Melbourne Gender:	Re: How Trump could overturn the 2024 election Reply #21 - Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:45am greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:37am: Panther wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:27am: I know who I voted for. A rapist and convicted felon? Smell the fear. have you finished packing those bags Greggy?
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thegreatdivide

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Re: How Trump could overturn the 2024 election
Reply #22 - Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:46am

Bobby. wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:45am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:37am:

Panther wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:27am:

I know who I voted for.

A rapist and convicted felon?

Smell the fear.

have you finished packing those bags Greggy? Undecided

Speculation; you'd be a fool to bet good money on the outcome.

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greggerypeccary

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Re: How Trump could overturn the 2024 election
Reply #23 - Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:52am

Bobby. wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:45am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:37am:

Panther wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:27am:

I know who I voted for.

A rapist and convicted felon?

Smell the fear.

From the women he might rape? Yes.

They have every right to be fearful of an adjudicated rapist.

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Bobby.

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Re: How Trump could overturn the 2024 election
Reply #24 - Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:54am

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:52am:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:45am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:37am:

Panther wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:27am:

I know who I voted for.

A rapist and convicted felon?

Smell the fear.

From the women he might rape? Yes.

They have every right to be fearful of an adjudicated rapist.

When you're a star they let you do it -
you can do anything -
grab them ...

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greggerypeccary

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Re: How Trump could overturn the 2024 election
Reply #25 - Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:54am

Panther wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:42am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:37am:

Panther wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:27am:

I know who I voted for.

A rapist and convicted felon?

You said it, I didn't......https://imgur.com/SvzDchb.gif

Under US law, Donald Trump is an adjudicated rapist and convicted felon.

If you voted for Trump, you voted for a criminal who has raped at least one woman.

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Bobby.

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Re: How Trump could overturn the 2024 election
Reply #26 - Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:58am

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:54am:

Panther wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:42am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:37am:

Panther wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:27am:

I know who I voted for.

A rapist and convicted felon?

You said it, I didn't......https://imgur.com/SvzDchb.gif

Under US law, Donald Trump is an adjudicated rapist and convicted felon.

If you voted for Trump, you voted for a criminal who has raped at least one woman.

Was that on CNN?

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greggerypeccary

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Re: How Trump could overturn the 2024 election
Reply #27 - Nov 4^th, 2024 at 11:00am

Armchair_Politician wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 9:53am:

There is absolutely no way that Donald Trump will accept the result of tomorrow's election if he is not declared the winner, it simply will not happen. That is the only thing about this election that I am certain of. Some polls have him ahead, while others have Harris in the lead. There are polls that have it so close the result may not be known for weeks, while others are predicting a landslide victory. But the only thing we can say with absolute certainty is that Trump will never, ever accept any other result than that which declares him the winner.

Trump has had the Republicans in state legislatures try (and succeed in some cases) to change voting laws to give him an edge - any boost he can find. He will no doubt launch a flurry of court cases in the days following the election. It makes me very happy to live in Australia with our centralised voting system. The system in use over in the US is admittedly an utter shambles. Laws vary from state to state, in some cases from one county to the next. There is no central organisation to oversee the election like we have here in the Australian Electoral Commission. Our system ensures a level playing field nation-wide, something sorely lacking in the US. It also means we don't see legal challenges like you see in the US, where teams of lawyers are kept on retainer to be deployed in the hours after voting closes. It's absurd and bizarre!

But as I said, there is no way on Earth that Trump will accept any result that doesn't declare him the winner and that spells big trouble for the US. We've already seen National Guard units deployed to Washington DC and other key battleground states in anticipation of violence following the election and on the day the election is certified in Congress. I predict that if Trump loses, the events of January 6 that occurred last time Trump lost will be a mere hiccup compared to what will happen this time thanks to his violent rhetoric.

His supporters in the MAGA cult will clearly do whatever they think they need to do to ensure their leader takes the White House. I saw a movie earlier this year called "Civil War", set in the modern United States - not to be confused with the colonial-era civil war. If I remember right, a couple of states tried to declare independence and cede from the United States of America, leading to a bloody, deadly civil war. It's not too hard to imagine similar violence occurring if Trump loses, such is the level of derangement of his supporters. I hope I am wrong, but sadly I don't think I am in this case.

Here's hoping that Harris wins and wins convincingly, along with the Democrats taking both Houses with them, because I can't see Republicans doing anything other than obstructing her entire agenda for four years if Republicans manage to win one of the Houses.

Yep, you're right.

He won't concede, and the ensuing violence will be on a whole new level.

I fear there will be many deaths at the hands of his deranged cult members.

Just like you, I hope I'm wrong, but it looks like it's inevitable.

How Donald Trump is laying the groundwork to dispute the election results – again

"Trump has made repeated false claims that Democrats are cheating in the election, and he’s twisted isolated problems with voting leading up to Election Day, all in an effort to prime his supporters to falsely believe the election is not legitimate if he loses."

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thegreatdivide

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Re: How Trump could overturn the 2024 election
Reply #28 - Nov 4^th, 2024 at 11:06am

Bobby. wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:54am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:52am:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:45am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:37am:

Panther wrote on Nov 4^th, 2024 at 10:27am:

I know who I voted for.

A rapist and convicted felon?

Smell the fear.

From the women he might rape? Yes.

They have every right to be fearful of an adjudicated rapist.

When you're a star they let you do it -
you can do anything -
grab them ...

Good point, I doubt Trumpy ever actually violently raped anyone. He obviously loves women...

And it's in the eye of the beholder, apparently; Lehman still hasn't been convicted.

Though Trump IS a convicted felon....despite access to clever lawyers...

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Karnal

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Re: How Trump could overturn the 2024 election
Reply #29 - Nov 4^th, 2024 at 11:21am

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 3^rd, 2024 at 4:04pm:

Karnal wrote on Nov 3^rd, 2024 at 3:43pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 3^rd, 2024 at 2:36pm:

Karnal wrote on Nov 3^rd, 2024 at 2:27pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 3^rd, 2024 at 12:55pm:

This is an excellent article.

The Very Real Scenario Where Trump Loses and Takes Power Anyway

Dozens of interviews with people deeply familiar or involved with the election process point to a clear consensus: Not only could Trump make a second attempt at overturning an election he loses, he and his allies are already laying the groundwork.

Just so. The real risk for the 2024 election:

Quote:

In hindsight, the resistance of Republican state legislators may have been the most significant bulwark against Trump’s bid to subvert the election in 2020. After they balked, the Trump campaign assembled informal slates of electors and had them sign paperwork claiming to be the legitimate slate.

Then-Vice President Mike Pence, who presided over Congress’ counting of electoral votes on Jan. 6, 2021, refused to consider those fake slates of electors because they hadn’t been endorsed by a government authority. But a little-noticed memo sent by Pence’s top legal adviser suggested Pence’s choice might have been different — in fact, it may have had to be — if legislatures had endorsed the pro-Trump slates.

The swing states could simply overturn the popular vote and put in Republican delegates. All it would take is a majority Congressional vote.

If this happens, democracy in America will go for good. People like Panther will simply claim the US is a Republic, not a democracy, and it's up to the states to choose their own prez.

The state legislatures - majority Republican because of their rural electorates - would then control the White House. They could apply the same tactic to the House and Senate. America would become a one-party state: a MAGA one-party state.

Laugh's right. The big fella's a disrupter. His legacy may very well be turning the US into an authoritarian diktat, with elections, as in Russia, a mere formality.

We'll have to wait and see what happens.

Or, Vice President Kamala Harris (as President of the Senate) could refuse to count the electoral college votes on January 6.

I mean, that's a thing ... isn't it? Undecided

Yes, but unfortunately the lawyer who suggested that one's up on a charge of election interference.

Oh my goodness!

Well, at least it was just one solitary lawyer who probably just made a silly mistake.

I mean, it's not like there was a whole group of people who set out to deliberately break the law and overturn a free and fair election.

And I'm sure Mr. Trump doesn't even know the guy.

[url]https://pyxis.nymag.com/v1/imgs/230/6a5/3e7aa6bc4589cc7dcbe0d459e25fa
fbbab-trump-indictment-GA-mugshots08.1x.rsquare.w1400.jpg[/url]

Just another disgruntled former lawyer, Greggery.

You know, like Rudy. The big fella still owes him $2 mil, but that's okay.

Rudy's going to give it to the two elections cheats he defamed.

LAWFARE !!!

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