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Labors half trillion dollar lie on renewables plan (Read 3552 times)
Brian Ross
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Re: Labors half trillion dollar lie on renewables plan
Reply #60 - Nov 24th, 2024 at 11:54am
 
Frank wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 11:18am:
Brian Ross wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 11:03am:

You didn't understand any of it.

It doesn't matter what the topic, it is way over your head.



...



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Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour.  Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe?  Tsk, tsk, tsk...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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thegreatdivide
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Re: Labors half trillion dollar lie on renewables plan
Reply #61 - Nov 24th, 2024 at 12:09pm
 
Frank wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 11:40am:
Australia is confronted by three big changes in our strategic circumstances that are making our steady-as-you-go approaches to security and economic development untenable.
 

O dear ... here comes The Oz.....

Quote:
We face a markedly increased risk of war in the Indo-Pacific; the global economy is restructuring rapidly in adverse ways; and the Australian economy has stalled with essentially zero productivity growth, declining international competitiveness and a flight of much-needed investment.


1. Because of the West's delusional 'freedom values' ideology; note: China doesn't want war,  and Taiwan is part of China. Suck it up, you "freedom or death" neandertal f**kwits. 

2. because the global financial system is based on debt, servicing greedy money-lenders.

3. because free markets don't work without intelligent government intervention; as for low productivity in Oz,  robots should be rolled out ASAP, and a three day week introduced. Private investors can go f**k themselves, the nation doesn't need their greedy arses.

The rest of the article is GIGO, as with most Murdoch rags.

 

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« Last Edit: Nov 24th, 2024 at 12:14pm by thegreatdivide »  
 
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Frank
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Re: Labors half trillion dollar lie on renewables plan
Reply #62 - Nov 24th, 2024 at 12:17pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 12:09pm:
Frank wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 11:40am:
Australia is confronted by three big changes in our strategic circumstances that are making our steady-as-you-go approaches to security and economic development untenable.
 

O dear ... here comes The Oz.....




The article's author:



Dr Ross Babbage AM

Ross Babbage is the Chief Executive Officer and a director of Strategic Forum.

He is also a Non-Resident Senior Fellow at the Center for Strategic and Budgetary Assessments (CSBA) in Washington, D.C. and Managing Director of Strategy International (ACT) Pty Ltd.  In addition, Ross is Founder of the Kokoda Foundation and a Founding Governor of the Institute for Regional Security, Chair of the Academic Council of the Australian Business Academy, a member of Accenture’s Advisory Board and a member of the Academic Advisory Council of the Menzies Research Centre.


Dr Babbage served for 16 years in the Australian Public Service holding several senior positions, including Head of Strategic Analysis in the Office of National Assessments and leading the branches in the Department of Defence responsible for ANZUS and global strategic policy and then Force Development. During the 1990s he held senior executive positions with ADI Pty Ltd, that was then Australia’s largest defence manufacturing and services organisation. In 2003 and 2004 he served as Head of the Strategic and Defence Studies Centre at the Australian National University. Dr Babbage was a special advisor to the Minister for Defence during the preparation of the 2009 Australian defence white paper. He was also served on the Council of the International Institute for Strategic Studies in London for a maximum six year term. He was appointed a Member of the Order of Australia in 2011.
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Estragon: I can’t go on like this.
Vladimir: That’s what you think.
 
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freediver
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Re: Labors half trillion dollar lie on renewables plan
Reply #63 - Nov 24th, 2024 at 12:21pm
 
Daves2017 wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 9:31am:
freediver wrote on Nov 23rd, 2024 at 10:29pm:
lee wrote on Nov 23rd, 2024 at 7:54pm:
freediver wrote on Nov 23rd, 2024 at 7:47pm:
Do you have a point Lee, or are you just trying to ask the dumbest possible questions?


No.

Didn't think so. Perhaps now we can get back to Dave explaining why he thinks we aren't allowed to use coal in Australia.


It’s my understanding we are in the process of closing down our coal fired power stations primarily because of there age and climate damage ( if you believe it).
This  assists us in meeting the Paris agreement.

The buzz wording is “ transition away from coal”.
So while coal cannot in the future be used to generate electricity in this country because it’s bad for the environment it’s perfectly ok for us to ship it overseas to be used to generate electricity.

Just like uranium, coal under goes some miracle at sea which means it’s no longer a dangerous pollution source?

Sorry the late reply, been walking the cat.



You are inventing the contradiction. It is OK to ship coal overseas, now. It is OK to use coal locally, now. Note the consistent use of present tense, which results in an entirely consistent set of actions. Most other developed, and even some developing countries, are way ahead of us on the transition. Your misunderstanding and childish misrepresentation of a mish mash of other people's opinions only needs to be explained by you, not by anyone else.

Why did you shift from metallurgical coal to thermal coal? Can you tell the difference?
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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.
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thegreatdivide
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Re: Labors half trillion dollar lie on renewables plan
Reply #64 - Nov 24th, 2024 at 12:30pm
 
Frank wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 12:17pm:
thegreatdivide wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 12:09pm:
Frank wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 11:40am:
Australia is confronted by three big changes in our strategic circumstances that are making our steady-as-you-go approaches to security and economic development untenable.
 

O dear ... here comes The Oz.....




The article's author:



Dr Ross Babbage AM

Ross Babbage is the Chief Executive Officer and a director of Strategic Forum.


So, at least not  the ASPI institute: "freedom values" f**kwits to a man.

Quote:
He is also a Non-Resident Senior Fellow at the Center for Strategic and Budgetary Assessments (CSBA) in Washington, D.C. and Managing Director of Strategy International (ACT) Pty Ltd.  In addition, Ross is Founder of the Kokoda Foundation and a Founding Governor of the Institute for Regional Security, Chair of the Academic Council of the Australian Business Academy, a member of Accenture’s Advisory Board and a member of the Academic Advisory Council of the Menzies Research Centre.


And Andrew Leigh is a Harvard-trained economist, which is the very reason WHY he is blinded by neoclassical "scarcity" dogma.

Quote:
Dr Babbage served for 16 years in the Australian Public Service holding several senior positions, including Head of Strategic Analysis in the Office of National Assessments and leading the branches in the Department of Defence responsible for ANZUS and global strategic policy and then Force Development.


Sounding more and more like a neanderthal ASPI f**kwit, willing to immolate the world over Taiwan's sovereignty.

Quote:
  During the 1990s he held senior executive positions with ADI Pty Ltd, that was then Australia’s largest defence manufacturing and services organisation. In 2003 and 2004 he served as Head of the Strategic and Defence Studies Centre at the Australian National University. Dr Babbage was a special advisor to the Minister for Defence during the preparation of the 2009 Australian defence white paper. He was also served on the Council of the International Institute for Strategic Studies in London for a maximum six year term. He was appointed a Member of the Order of Australia in 2011.


He is certainly qualified to join the f**kwits at the ASPI....doubt he can match Leigh's economic qualifications ( anachronistic as they are...)
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« Last Edit: Nov 24th, 2024 at 1:08pm by thegreatdivide »  
 
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Daves2017
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Re: Labors half trillion dollar lie on renewables plan
Reply #65 - Nov 24th, 2024 at 12:33pm
 
https://globalnews.ca/news/627069/the-coal-facts-thermal-coal-vs-metallurgical-c...

Are you suggesting when our transition is completed and we no longer burn coal in Australia that the entire export of coal from our shores will cease?

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Thomas A. Edison said as early as in 1931, “I’d put my money on the sun and solar energy. What a source of power! I hope we don’t have to wait until oil and coal run out before we tackle that.”
 
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lee
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Re: Labors half trillion dollar lie on renewables plan
Reply #66 - Nov 24th, 2024 at 12:41pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 11:52am:
1. The current supply of gas is sufficient to ensure grid stability, in a scenario where the rollout of renewables is massively increased,   eg ten Suncable equivalents with UHV technology to transmit the electricty to where its needed.


And even when renewables are not rolled out. Providing that the greenies don't manage to stop research and mining. Cool

thegreatdivide wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 11:52am:
And the massive midday excess (over Oz energy requirements) could be transmitted to Asia.


So the bloke with no engineering says. You haven't stated where these renewables are located. What time zones? Time Zones? Those things that cause variation in output. Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin

thegreatdivide wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 11:52am:
2. Massive subsidies of home batteries for rooftop solar, and VtoG EVs all interconnected would be a huge grid stabiliser.


Stabiliser? When you want to start your EV in the morning? Rooftop solar is just too variable. They generally don't use tracking. And then of course there are plenty of those mounted on East or west side facing. What is the output timeline on them daily?

Just another example of you just reading the headlines. Roll Eyes

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Re: Labors half trillion dollar lie on renewables plan
Reply #67 - Nov 24th, 2024 at 12:41pm
 
Daves2017 wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 12:33pm:
https://globalnews.ca/news/627069/the-coal-facts-thermal-coal-vs-metallurgical-c...

Are you suggesting when our transition is completed and we no longer burn coal in Australia that the entire export of coal from our shores will cease?



I don't think Paula Baker posts here Dave. That link is to a different website.
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thegreatdivide
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Re: Labors half trillion dollar lie on renewables plan
Reply #68 - Nov 24th, 2024 at 12:53pm
 
freediver wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 12:21pm:
Daves2017 wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 9:31am:
freediver wrote on Nov 23rd, 2024 at 10:29pm:
lee wrote on Nov 23rd, 2024 at 7:54pm:
freediver wrote on Nov 23rd, 2024 at 7:47pm:
Do you have a point Lee, or are you just trying to ask the dumbest possible questions?


No.

Didn't think so. Perhaps now we can get back to Dave explaining why he thinks we aren't allowed to use coal in Australia.


It’s my understanding we are in the process of closing down our coal fired power stations primarily because of there age and climate damage ( if you believe it).
This  assists us in meeting the Paris agreement.

The buzz wording is “ transition away from coal”.
So while coal cannot in the future be used to generate electricity in this country because it’s bad for the environment it’s perfectly ok for us to ship it overseas to be used to generate electricity.

Just like uranium, coal under goes some miracle at sea which means it’s no longer a dangerous pollution source?

Sorry the late reply, been walking the cat.



You are inventing the contradiction.


Not really, though I'm not sure he saw my answers to his quesions.

Quote:
It is OK to ship coal overseas, now. It is OK to use coal locally, now.


No it's not (if AGW-CO2 is real, and a climate catastrophe is emerging; as a majority of the world's climate scientists are claiming.....and increasinly appears to be true)

Quote:
  Note the consistent use of present tense, which results in an entirely consistent set of actions.


No it doesn't.

Oz is the one country in the world - a vast sunny desert with windy coastlines, and a small population - which could transition to near zero emissions within a decade. 

Quote:
Most other developed, and even some developing countries, are way ahead of us on the transition.


Yes.   

Quote:
Why did you shift from metallurgical coal to thermal coal? Can you tell the difference?


Admittedly I had to answer some fairly basic questions from him...

Re metallurgical coal, its days are also numbered,  as green hydrogen fired smelters come on line.
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thegreatdivide
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Re: Labors half trillion dollar lie on renewables plan
Reply #69 - Nov 24th, 2024 at 1:01pm
 
Daves2017 wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 12:33pm:
https://globalnews.ca/news/627069/the-coal-facts-thermal-coal-vs-metallurgical-c...

Are you suggesting when our transition is completed and we no longer burn coal in Australia that the entire export of coal from our shores will cease?


Well, we along with most of the world  are signed up to zero emissions by 2050, China by 2060, and India by 2070 (...the US?...who knows....but the US doesn't need Oz coal).
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thegreatdivide
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Re: Labors half trillion dollar lie on renewables plan
Reply #70 - Nov 24th, 2024 at 1:20pm
 
lee wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 12:41pm:
thegreatdivide wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 11:52am:
1. The current supply of gas is sufficient to ensure grid stability, in a scenario where the rollout of renewables is massively increased,   eg ten Suncable equivalents with UHV technology to transmit the electricty to where its needed.


And even when renewables are not rolled out. Providing that the greenies don't manage to stop research and mining. Cool


Poor lee: "climate hoax" theorist extraordinaire.

Quote:
So the bloke with no engineering says. You haven't stated where these renewables are located. What time zones? Time Zones? Those things that cause variation in output. Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin


Speak to the Singapore govenrment (who have access to some clever engineers); they have aleardy signed an agreement with Suncable.

Quote:
Stabiliser?


Yes; some homes will largely power themselves  24/7 (given battery storage) during periods of sunny weather; and other homes will do same in different areas of the country at different times; grid interconnection is required of course.   Excess renewables can be exported overseas, with UHV tranmission.


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Daves2017
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Re: Labors half trillion dollar lie on renewables plan
Reply #71 - Nov 24th, 2024 at 1:29pm
 
I just want to make sure I understand exactly where Albo is taking us-

We as a nation transition to renewables.

We then cease mining and export of coal.

We lose a estimated 91 billion dollar industry and its payment of royalties.

NSW government alone gains 2.7 billion a year in royalties. Which disappear.

Ok, that’s what Albo is taking to the election!

Just a question, how do they plug the black hole in the budget that losing billions in royalties will create?

The job losses, what the mining industry is going too transition into hospitality?

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Thomas A. Edison said as early as in 1931, “I’d put my money on the sun and solar energy. What a source of power! I hope we don’t have to wait until oil and coal run out before we tackle that.”
 
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lee
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Re: Labors half trillion dollar lie on renewables plan
Reply #72 - Nov 24th, 2024 at 3:39pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 1:20pm:
Poor lee: "climate hoax" theorist extraordinaire.


And yet you haven't quantified where these renewables will come from. Nothing to do with climate. RENEWABLES. Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin

thegreatdivide wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 1:20pm:
Speak to the Singapore govenrment (who have access to some clever engineers); they have aleardy signed an agreement with Suncable.


And the Suncable haven't got the renewables. But it is a CONDITIONAL agreement. You know what CONDITIONAL means? It means there are CONDITIONS attached. Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin

thegreatdivide wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 1:20pm:
Yes; some homes will largely power themselves  24/7 (given battery storage) during periods of sunny weather; and other homes will do same in different areas of the country at different times; grid interconnection is required of course.


Household solar doesn't stabilise the grid. Extra are needed. Funded by whom?

thegreatdivide wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 1:20pm:
Excess renewables can be exported overseas, with UHV tranmission.


Wow Now you are going to have UHV transmission to every hub. Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin

Once again doesn't read beyond the headlines. And doesn't even read the headlines correctly. Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin
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Daves2017
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Re: Labors half trillion dollar lie on renewables plan
Reply #73 - Nov 24th, 2024 at 8:24pm
 
“The total value of Australia's energy exports in the 2019-2020 financial year was $115.5 billion.”

“https://taxpolicy.crawford.anu.edu.au ›

So to achieve net zero Australia will not only fund Chinese made windmills but are certain to lose 115.5 million dollars in revenue by closing our mines and cutting off our export market?

We need to have a adult conversation.



I see we have only three options if Albo survive the next election-

Rise taxes.

Decrease services ( we can balance the budget if we do away with police, schools, hospitals.)

Or a combination of both.

Consider, what could possibly go wrong-

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-61028138.amp

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« Last Edit: Nov 24th, 2024 at 8:32pm by Daves2017 »  

Thomas A. Edison said as early as in 1931, “I’d put my money on the sun and solar energy. What a source of power! I hope we don’t have to wait until oil and coal run out before we tackle that.”
 
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philperth2010
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Re: Labors half trillion dollar lie on renewables plan
Reply #74 - Nov 26th, 2024 at 11:57am
 
Daves2017 wrote on Nov 24th, 2024 at 1:29pm:
I just want to make sure I understand exactly where Albo is taking us-

We as a nation transition to renewables.

We then cease mining and export of coal.

We lose a estimated 91 billion dollar industry and its payment of royalties.

NSW government alone gains 2.7 billion a year in royalties. Which disappear.

Ok, that’s what Albo is taking to the election!

Just a question, how do they plug the black hole in the budget that losing billions in royalties will create?

The job losses, what the mining industry is going too transition into hospitality?



So your argument is that climate change is a hoax and coal will continue to be exported at the current rate....As the world moves away from fossil fuel how do you expect Australia to maintain it's current levels of exports....The Coalition are taking more fossil fuels and no investment in renewable energy to the next election....Australia cannot afford Peter Dutton and the Coal industry running the country???

Huh Huh Huh
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If knowledge can create problems, it is not through ignorance that we can solve them.
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