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First Nations? (Read 1122 times)
UnSubRocky
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Re: First Nations?
Reply #15 - Dec 24th, 2024 at 12:32pm
 
Switzerland, Italy, France, Belgium, China, and India have genuinely become nations. There are areas of China and India that have wanted to seek their own independence. But, in general, the region is made up of interconnected language and cultural groups that interact generally peacefully.

Indigenous Australia were either at war with each other, or showed a mutual respect. The reason why there was not 10 million indigenous Australians on the continent at the time of the European arrival was because it was difficult for the indigenous people to survive beyond 40 years of age. Not saying that many British explorers made it much pass 60 years of age. But the telling difference is that the British explorers settled the area with a system of taming the wild, rather than living with the problems that indigenous people had to endure.

Europeans had no obligation to look after indigenous Australians during the first 100 years of colonisation. The fact is, the European explorers had to defend themselves from the attacks that indigenous Australians perpetuated against them.
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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM
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Re: First Nations?
Reply #16 - Dec 24th, 2024 at 5:29pm
 
They've developed massively from their early origins - The Akubra Effect...  they have schools they don't largely go to; scholarships that a few take up; affirmative action for decades now; basic needs met in cash and homing.

Now it's time to advance themselves....
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Frank
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Re: First Nations?
Reply #17 - Dec 24th, 2024 at 5:47pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Dec 24th, 2024 at 12:05pm:
Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Dec 23rd, 2024 at 4:30pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Dec 23rd, 2024 at 3:38pm:
Gordon wrote on Dec 23rd, 2024 at 1:55pm:
Good video, says it all.

There was no nation, just a bunch of dispersed and disconnected rudimentary hunter gatherers who had little to do with other groups outside of their local areas.


And who is to say that they cannot develop a sense of nationhood post settlement?  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Yes - it's called Australian.... tsk, tsk, tsk.


A nation that has essentially ignored their development throughout it's short history.

Quote:
So now some hypothetical 'sense of nationhood' means they were and are a nation?


They are as much a nation as any other.  Most nations consist of disparate cultural and language groups.  Switzerland has three distinct language and cultural groups.  Italy has many cultural groups.  France many.  Belgium two. China hundreds, India many.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

Most nations have a history that binds them, a shared culture, literature, art,  affinity and solidarity that brings them together. It is a distinctly European notion, evident only in European and European- derived countries/cultures. Even Japan is a European-derivided nation in this sense, from the 19th century.
This is why most Asian, Arab and African countries are not nations.
Aborigines certainly aren't. I would hazard that almost all Aboriginal self-understanding is thanks to British colonisation: writing down their stories, languages, post-1788 history, self-consciouness AS Aborigines.  Their entire Aboriginal identity is possible only because of the arrival of the British.


Aborigines had no history, no shared culture,
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Gnads
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Re: First Nations?
Reply #18 - Dec 24th, 2024 at 10:04pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Dec 23rd, 2024 at 3:38pm:
Gordon wrote on Dec 23rd, 2024 at 1:55pm:
Good video, says it all.

There was no nation, just a bunch of dispersed and disconnected rudimentary hunter gatherers who had little to do with other groups outside of their local areas.


And who is to say that they cannot develop a sense of nationhood post settlement?  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


And how is that relevant to the fact there were no First Nations......

which is what is being espoused by activists along with the Frontier Wars furphy.

What never was can not be in todays Australia.

Seems you would be one to push the lie long enough until it becomes the truth.
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Gnads
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Re: First Nations?
Reply #19 - Dec 24th, 2024 at 10:07pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Dec 24th, 2024 at 12:05pm:
Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Dec 23rd, 2024 at 4:30pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Dec 23rd, 2024 at 3:38pm:
Gordon wrote on Dec 23rd, 2024 at 1:55pm:
Good video, says it all.

There was no nation, just a bunch of dispersed and disconnected rudimentary hunter gatherers who had little to do with other groups outside of their local areas.


And who is to say that they cannot develop a sense of nationhood post settlement?  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Yes - it's called Australian.... tsk, tsk, tsk.


A nation that has essentially ignored their development throughout it's short history.

Quote:
So now some hypothetical 'sense of nationhood' means they were and are a nation?


They are as much a nation as any other.  Most nations consist of disparate cultural and language groups.  Switzerland has three distinct language and cultural groups.  Italy has many cultural groups.  France many.  Belgium two. China hundreds, India many.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes



No they are not .... and you either didn't watch that video clip or you're ignoring it to continue your pushing of the lie.
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Sir Eoin O Fada
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Re: First Nations?
Reply #20 - Dec 25th, 2024 at 7:03am
 
First Notion.
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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM
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Re: First Nations?
Reply #21 - Dec 25th, 2024 at 12:44pm
 
The same problems in Nu Zulland with all the 'activists' and poseurs with a bit of Maori leading the rush for some sort of 'sovereignty' and demanding two governments. On SBS right now.

Demonstrations carrying war clubs and such, Thorpe type carrying on Parliament, twisted thinking about realities, unwillingness to be under the same laws as everyone else and accept that they have equal rights.

Maybe they need a Two State Solution.....
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Re: First Nations?
Reply #22 - Dec 25th, 2024 at 7:09pm
 
Merry social construct oppressive patriarchal and paternalistic White Person's Christmas to all those of the First etc Invaders all the way up to The Big One in 1788 that brought civilisation and Merry Christmas all year round for the indolent from the cargo cult that just keeps on giving... and then Merry Christmas to all our later Invaders including our Muslim friends - may they live in and thrive on the tolerance of living in a nation based on Christian values.

And a special shout out to our friends in Syria, whether they be Muslims or Christians or whatever... may they live in peace and harmony for all time now that the Oppressor has been overthrown.

...
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Jasin
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Re: First Nations?
Reply #23 - Dec 25th, 2024 at 7:56pm
 
Maori of NZ and 'blacks' of Australia are using the threat of future violence if they don't get their way.
The Media supports them and manipulates them into believing it's  all the fault of that Union Jack on the Flag.

...which is like Italy whispering in their ears "Blame British politics, not mine"
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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM
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Re: First Nations?
Reply #24 - Dec 27th, 2024 at 11:14am
 
Jasin wrote on Dec 25th, 2024 at 7:56pm:
Maori of NZ and 'blacks' of Australia are using the threat of future violence if they don't get their way.
The Media supports them and manipulates them into believing it's  all the fault of that Union Jack on the Flag.

...which is like Italy whispering in their ears "Blame British politics, not mine"


The Maori march down the street carrying weapons.... our mobs - all countless thousands of them all mixed up with every other race, content themselves with doing crime and criminal lawfare, with the help of the mindless media and many 'governments' about to Fall, in their Intifada ...... I see no good coming from this...

Rudd should never have raised the arse by saying 'sorry' and actually expecting that to be the end of it .... but politicians by and large are blessed with cunning and not intelligence.... look at the 'future leaders' currently going through universities etc.... the ones who mark papers can't handle paper clips, plastic page covers or heaven forbid - staples... they should have extra letters FPCPCS.. Frightened of Paper Clips, Page Covers and Staples...  OH & S you know - they might cut a finger once in every 500,000 pages... due to lack of manual skills and training in depth... and the possible danger to their mental and physical health is potentially disastrous...

Never been the same since they pushed forward too many sheilas.... at least The People are starting to wake up - become the Truly
Woke - following Albo's 'voice' debacle and the ongoing lawfare.
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Frank
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Re: First Nations?
Reply #25 - Dec 27th, 2024 at 1:01pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Dec 24th, 2024 at 12:05pm:
Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Dec 23rd, 2024 at 4:30pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Dec 23rd, 2024 at 3:38pm:
Gordon wrote on Dec 23rd, 2024 at 1:55pm:
Good video, says it all.

There was no nation, just a bunch of dispersed and disconnected rudimentary hunter gatherers who had little to do with other groups outside of their local areas.


And who is to say that they cannot develop a sense of nationhood post settlement?  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Yes - it's called Australian.... tsk, tsk, tsk.


A nation that has essentially ignored their development throughout it's short history.

Quote:
So now some hypothetical 'sense of nationhood' means they were and are a nation?


They are as much a nation as any other.  Most nations consist of disparate cultural and language groups.  Switzerland has three distinct language and cultural groups.  Italy has many cultural groups.  France many.  Belgium two. China hundreds, India many.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

Who the hell wants to be like China or India???

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Boris
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Re: First Nations?
Reply #26 - Jan 1st, 2025 at 10:27pm
 
http://webdoc.sub.gwdg.de/ebook/p/2005/strehlow-research/journeyhorseshoebend.pd...


page 58

The only reason for this party's going
into hiding was to ensure that every member of
the Irbmangkara population had returned to the
camp before the murderous assault was undertaken.
These fifty or sixty tnengka had accordingly been split into three parties upon arrival at Urualbukara - two parties took up positions on
the hill slopes of Ilaltilalta and Lalkitnama respectively, while the third hid in the thick undergrowth that covered the river bed south of the
camps. This arrangement was intended to frustrate any attempts of escape on the part of the
victims.
The sun had sunk very low in the western sky
before the waiting warriors could be reasonably
certain that all members of the Irbmangkara
camp had returned. Keeping under the cover of
bushes and trees, the armed men crept forward
with the relentless and uncanny skill of hunters
used to stalking suspicious game animals. As
soon as the clearing around the camp had been
reached, they rushed in, like swift dingoes upon
a flock of unsuspecting emus. Spears and boomerangs flew with deadly aim. Within a matter
of minutes Ltjabakuka and his men were lying
lifeless in their blood at their brush shelters.
Then the warriors turned their murderous attention to the women and older children, and either
speared or clubbed them to death. Finally, according to the grim custom of warriors and
avengers, they broke the limbs of the infants,
leaving them to die "natural deaths". The final
number of the dead could well have reached the
high figure of from eighty to a hundred men,
women, and children. Before leaving the
stricken camp, the bodies of all clubbed victims
were prodded with spears to make certain that
there was no life left in them. For the warriors
had to be sure beyond all doubt that no eyewitnesses had survived who could later on incite
reprisals against them. Satisfied that they had
carried out their grim task with flawless precision, the warriors now left the Urualbukara
camp. But they had made one fatal mistake. Laparintja, one of Ltjabakuka's wives, though severely clubbed, had merely shammed death,
and had succeeded in stifling her urge to scream
while being prodded by a spear point. She had
in addition successfully covered her bloodstained baby son Kaltjirbuka under her own
prostrate body. As soon as the avengers had
departed, she raised herself cautiously; and,
taking her child with her, she had slowly wriggled towards the bulrush thickets that grew on
the edges of the closest pool. Once she had
reached the bulrushes, it was an easy matter for
her to make good her escape northward to
Irbmangkara, and beyond the uppermost pools
towards Arbanta, where another
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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM
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Re: First Nations?
Reply #27 - Jan 5th, 2025 at 11:42am
 
https://www.msn.com/en-au/news/australia/staggering-cost-of-welcome-to-country-c...

Well - the 'welcome to your own country' grift continues....

Jeez - the Lawfare's mighty quiet in this looming election year... do not forget what has been done people... you can never forget.  Unlike the clans etc driven off clan land in the Enclosures to suit the lords etc, you have a vote and you have the power - vote them all out and demand they sack their public servant lackeys who create this rubbish in their inner fantasies.

Poor Fellow - My Country - who do we vote for?
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« Last Edit: Jan 5th, 2025 at 11:50am by Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM »  

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Brian Ross
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Re: First Nations?
Reply #28 - Jan 5th, 2025 at 12:29pm
 
The European nations fought many internal wars such as The War of the Roses:

Quote:
The Wars of the Roses, known at the time and in following centuries as the Civil Wars, were a series of civil wars fought over control of the English throne from 1455 to 1487. The wars were fought between supporters of the House of Lancaster and House of York, two rival cadet branches of the royal House of Plantagenet. The conflict resulted in the end of Lancaster's male line in 1471, leaving the Tudor family to inherit their claim to the throne through the female line. Conflict was largely brought to an end upon the union of the two houses through marriage, creating the Tudor dynasty that would subsequently rule England.

Source

This was followed by the English Civil War:

Quote:
The English Civil War was a series of civil wars and political machinations between Royalists and Parliamentarians in the Kingdom of England[b] from 1642 to 1651. Part of the wider 1639 to 1653 Wars of the Three Kingdoms, the struggle consisted of the First English Civil War and the Second English Civil War. The Anglo-Scottish War of 1650 to 1652 is sometimes referred to as the Third English Civil War.

Source

On the Continent the Europeans engaged in civil wars of their own. For example in France:

Quote:
    the war culminating in the Battle of Soissons (923)
    Armagnac–Burgundian Civil War (1407–1435)
    War of the Public Weal (1465)
    Mad War (1485–1488)
    French Wars of Religion (1562–1598)
    The Fronde (1648–1653)
    French Revolutionary Wars
        Chouannerie (1792–1800)
        War in the Vendée (1793–1796)
    Chouannerie of 1832 [fr]
    French civil war of 1871 [fr], including the Paris Commune
    the conflict between Vichy France and Free France during World War II (1940–1945), including the
        Battle of Dakar
        Battle of Réunion
        Battle of Gabon
        French Resistance
    Algerian War (1954–1962)

Source

Then in Germany there were:

Quote:
    German Peasants' War (1524–1525)
    Schmalkaldic War (1546–1547)
    Second Schmalkaldic War (1552)
    Thirty Years' War (1618–1648)
    Austro-Prussian War (1866)
    The political violence (1918–1933)
        The German Revolution (1918–1919)
        Hamburg Uprising (1923)
        Beer Hall Putsch (1923)
    20 July plot (1944)

Source

In Italy there occurred:
Quote:
The Italian Civil War (Italian: Guerra civile italiana, pronounced [ˈɡwɛrra tʃiˈviːle itaˈljaːna]) was a civil war in the Kingdom of Italy fought during the Italian campaign of World War II between Italian fascists and Italian partisans (mostly politically organized in the National Liberation Committee) and, to a lesser extent, the Italian Co-belligerent Army.

Source

Who is to say that the Indigenous Australians are not now seeing their own renaissance and forming their own national identity?  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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« Last Edit: Jan 5th, 2025 at 2:01pm by Brian Ross »  

It seems that I have upset a Moderator and are forbidden from using memes. So much for Freedom of Speech. Tsk, tsk, tsk...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Frank
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Re: First Nations?
Reply #29 - Jan 5th, 2025 at 12:49pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jan 5th, 2025 at 12:29pm:
The European nations fought many internal wars such as The War of the Roses:

Quote:
The Wars of the Roses, known at the time and in following centuries as the Civil Wars, were a series of civil wars fought over control of the English throne from 1455 to 1487. The wars were fought between supporters of the House of Lancaster and House of York, two rival cadet branches of the royal House of Plantagenet. The conflict resulted in the end of Lancaster's male line in 1471, leaving the Tudor family to inherit their claim to the throne through the female line. Conflict was largely brought to an end upon the union of the two houses through marriage, creating the Tudor dynasty that would subsequently rule England.

Source

This was followed by the English Civil War:

Quote:
The English Civil War was a series of civil wars and political machinations between Royalists and Parliamentarians in the Kingdom of England[b] from 1642 to 1651. Part of the wider 1639 to 1653 Wars of the Three Kingdoms, the struggle consisted of the First English Civil War and the Second English Civil War. The Anglo-Scottish War of 1650 to 1652 is sometimes referred to as the Third English Civil War.

Source

On the Continent the Europeans engaged in civil wars of their own. For example:

Quote:
    the war culminating in the Battle of Soissons (923)
    Armagnac–Burgundian Civil War (1407–1435)
    War of the Public Weal (1465)
    Mad War (1485–1488)
    French Wars of Religion (1562–1598)
    The Fronde (1648–1653)
    French Revolutionary Wars
        Chouannerie (1792–1800)
        War in the Vendée (1793–1796)
    Chouannerie of 1832 [fr]
    French civil war of 1871 [fr], including the Paris Commune
    the conflict between Vichy France and Free France during World War II (1940–1945), including the
        Battle of Dakar
        Battle of Réunion
        Battle of Gabon
        French Resistance
    Algerian War (1954–1962)

Source

Then in Germany there were:

Quote:
    German Peasants' War (1524–1525)
    Schmalkaldic War (1546–1547)
    Second Schmalkaldic War (1552)
    Thirty Years' War (1618–1648)
    Austro-Prussian War (1866)
    The political violence (1918–1933)
        The German Revolution (1918–1919)
        Hamburg Uprising (1923)
        Beer Hall Putsch (1923)
    20 July plot (1944)

Source

In Italy there occurred:
Quote:
The Italian Civil War (Italian: Guerra civile italiana, pronounced [ˈɡwɛrra tʃiˈviːle itaˈljaːna]) was a civil war in the Kingdom of Italy fought during the Italian campaign of World War II between Italian fascists and Italian partisans (mostly politically organized in the National Liberation Committee) and, to a lesser extent, the Italian Co-belligerent Army.

Source

Who is to say that the Indigenous Australians are not now seeing their own renaissance and forming their own national identity?  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Everybody.

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