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At Risk Under The Coalition Super Proposal (Read 404 times)
whiteknight
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At Risk Under The Coalition Super Proposal
Jan 17th, 2025 at 6:41am
 
Australians risk losing hundreds of thousands in retirement income under Coalition super proposal   Sad
January 16, 2025 ACTU.
The ACTU warns that the current push by Coalition members to cut superannuation will cost the average 30-year-old worker around $165,000 in retirement income.

Key Coalition members, including Alex Antic, Matt Canavan and Llew O’Brien, have voiced support for cutting the superannuation guarantee rate from 12 per cent to 9 per cent if the Coalition wins the upcoming election.

The reduction of 3 per cent in compulsory employer-paid superannuation, with the accompanying decline in compounding returns, will mean that the average 30-year-old worker today will lose around $165,000 in retirement income, according to ACTU estimates.

The Coalition members’ reported comments raise questions about how far the Coalition will go to undermine the hard-won entitlements of Australian workers.

In a Sydney University speech in October last year, Shadow Treasurer Angus Taylor stated that the Coalition’s ambition included “aligning superannuation with other global retirement schemes – like [the United States of America’s] 401k.”

Australia’s superannuation system is consistently ranked one of the best in the world and allows Australians to retire with significantly more retirement income than the mediocre US system provides.

Quotes attributable to ACTU Assistant Secretary, Joseph Mitchell:

“Working Australians can’t afford to lose $165,000 or more in retirement income. Super is a workplace right and should be protected, not attacked by out-of-touch politicians.

“The Coalition members suggesting a reduction in the superannuation guarantee are very happy to continue to receive 15.4 per cent superannuation for their own retirements. The Coalition’s hypocrisy is unbelievable – they want to enjoy the benefits of super for themselves while robbing working people of it.

“The last time the Coalition were in power, they froze super and forced people to raid their super to get by in a pandemic. Now, they’re talking about cutting super and getting workers to raid what’s left for more expensive houses.

“It’s clear that working people’s wages and retirement savings are at risk under Peter Dutton.

“Working people, through their unions, built a world-class superannuation system. We will defend super for future generations because every worker deserves a comfortable and dignified retirement.”
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Re: At Risk Under The Coalition Super Proposal
Reply #1 - Jan 17th, 2025 at 8:15am
 
Quote:
The reduction of 3 per cent in compulsory employer-paid superannuation


Great idea. Compulsory super is a huge waste of money. The compliance paperwork alone costs each worker at least $1000 a year, and that's if you go with the cheapest option available and do all the investing and most of the paperwork yourself. On top of that, they pay a huge amount of additional interest on their mortgage because they do not have access to their own income.
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John Smith
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Re: At Risk Under The Coalition Super Proposal
Reply #2 - Jan 17th, 2025 at 8:17am
 
It should not be compulsory
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Re: At Risk Under The Coalition Super Proposal
Reply #3 - Jan 17th, 2025 at 9:39am
 
If they reduce the compulsory element then the voluntary pre-tax contribution threshold should be increased by that much or more.
A certain compulsory component (compulsory savings, effectively, with compound interest, the eighth wonder of the world, according to Einstein) is a good idea but people should also have a greater ability/incentive to calibrate their own contributions as it suits them.

Some sectors have different rates of employer contribution super, negotiated by their unions, typically in the public sector. Universities pay 17% , public service 15.4%. Plus the compulsory employee contribution.

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Re: At Risk Under The Coalition Super Proposal
Reply #4 - Jan 17th, 2025 at 9:52am
 
Quote:
A certain compulsory component (compulsory savings, effectively, with compound interest, the eighth wonder of the world, according to Einstein) is a good idea


If there is a small compulsory component, you will end up losing most of your earnings to compliance administration costs. People can still earn compound interest without being forced to by the government.
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Frank
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Re: At Risk Under The Coalition Super Proposal
Reply #5 - Jan 17th, 2025 at 11:09am
 
freediver wrote on Jan 17th, 2025 at 9:52am:
Quote:
A certain compulsory component (compulsory savings, effectively, with compound interest, the eighth wonder of the world, according to Einstein) is a good idea


If there is a small compulsory component, you will end up losing most of your earnings to compliance administration costs. People can still earn compound interest without being forced to by the government.

Where? Banks have admin fees.
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Re: At Risk Under The Coalition Super Proposal
Reply #6 - Jan 17th, 2025 at 11:20am
 
Frank wrote on Jan 17th, 2025 at 11:09am:
freediver wrote on Jan 17th, 2025 at 9:52am:
Quote:
A certain compulsory component (compulsory savings, effectively, with compound interest, the eighth wonder of the world, according to Einstein) is a good idea


If there is a small compulsory component, you will end up losing most of your earnings to compliance administration costs. People can still earn compound interest without being forced to by the government.

Where? Banks have admin fees.


The cheapest option I am aware of is esuperfund. It costs $1000 in admin fees each year. You have to manage the investments, and collect and submit all the tax related paperwork to their system. You can invest in shares, managed funds, bitcoin, fixed interest etc. 

Most other super fund managers charge several times that amount. But it is generally taken as a percentage of your balance, so they do not wipe out the small investors.

Look at your super paperwork. It might be somewhat hidden, but there are generally fees there that you would not be paying if you invested the money the same way outside of super.
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Frank
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Re: At Risk Under The Coalition Super Proposal
Reply #7 - Jan 17th, 2025 at 11:47am
 
freediver wrote on Jan 17th, 2025 at 11:20am:
Frank wrote on Jan 17th, 2025 at 11:09am:
freediver wrote on Jan 17th, 2025 at 9:52am:
Quote:
A certain compulsory component (compulsory savings, effectively, with compound interest, the eighth wonder of the world, according to Einstein) is a good idea


If there is a small compulsory component, you will end up losing most of your earnings to compliance administration costs. People can still earn compound interest without being forced to by the government.

Where? Banks have admin fees.


The cheapest option I am aware of is esuperfund. It costs $1000 in admin fees each year. You have to manage the investments, and collect and submit all the tax related paperwork to their system. You can invest in shares, managed funds, bitcoin, fixed interest etc. 

Most other super fund managers charge several times that amount. But it is generally taken as a percentage of your balance, so they do not wipe out the small investors.

Look at your super paperwork. It might be somewhat hidden, but there are generally fees there that you would not be paying if you invested the money the same way outside of super.


My admin fee at Unisuper is $48 for the financial year, so probably $100 for the whole 12 months. If there are hidden fees they are well hidden.

Admittedly, I cannot control particular investments in particular companies but can and do choose between various safe- balanced- growth- high growth - green - cash etc mixes.
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freediver
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Re: At Risk Under The Coalition Super Proposal
Reply #8 - Jan 17th, 2025 at 12:11pm
 
Quote:
My admin fee at Unisuper is $48 for the financial year, so probably $100 for the whole 12 months. If there are hidden fees they are well hidden.


You probably just have to read the fine print. Also, the financial year is 12 months long.

Quote:
Admittedly, I cannot control particular investments in particular companies but can and do choose between various safe- balanced- growth- high growth - green - cash etc mixes.


This probably costs you even more.

Unisuper was one of the better ones last time I checked though.
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Re: At Risk Under The Coalition Super Proposal
Reply #9 - Jan 17th, 2025 at 2:38pm
 
All super is a scam!

If Duddo and dud team cut compulsory super by 3% and the workers receive that 3% via wages I’m all for it!

However I suspect once the employee cuts that 3% it will remain in profits and the employees are actually having their wages go backwards?

Please correct me if I’m wrong?
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Re: At Risk Under The Coalition Super Proposal
Reply #10 - Jan 17th, 2025 at 4:10pm
 
Daves2017 wrote on Jan 17th, 2025 at 2:38pm:
All super is a scam!

If Duddo and dud team cut compulsory super by 3% and the workers receive that 3% via wages I’m all for it!

However I suspect once the employee cuts that 3% it will remain in profits and the employees are actually having their wages go backwards?

Please correct me if I’m wrong?


You are wrong. The market determines your salary. Unless you are on minimum wages, in which case the unions will probably use it to justify an increase, although I doubt they were offering to accept a cut when super came in. They saw it as free money.

The market determines your total salary, including super. For most people, salary will inevitably go up to reflect the lower cost of employing people. It might even reduce unemployment.
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Re: At Risk Under The Coalition Super Proposal
Reply #11 - Jan 18th, 2025 at 10:00am
 
freediver wrote on Jan 17th, 2025 at 4:10pm:
Daves2017 wrote on Jan 17th, 2025 at 2:38pm:
All super is a scam!

If Duddo and dud team cut compulsory super by 3% and the workers receive that 3% via wages I’m all for it!

However I suspect once the employee cuts that 3% it will remain in profits and the employees are actually having their wages go backwards?

Please correct me if I’m wrong?


You are wrong. The market determines your salary. Unless you are on minimum wages, in which case the unions will probably use it to justify an increase, although I doubt they were offering to accept a cut when super came in. They saw it as free money.

The market determines your total salary, including super. For most people, salary will inevitably go up to reflect the lower cost of employing people. It might even reduce unemployment.

Productivity.

In 2022, the average labour productivity in OECD countries stood at $67.5 per hour. Ireland and Norway stand out with the highest productivity levels, exceeding $160 per hour, more than double the OECD average.
Denmark, Switzerland, Luxembourg, Belgium, = above $100.

Australia= $79


NZ = $54
Mexico =$24.

https://qery.no/highest-and-lowest-productivity-levels-in-oecd-countries-in-2022...

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Frank
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Re: At Risk Under The Coalition Super Proposal
Reply #12 - Jan 18th, 2025 at 10:01am
 
freediver wrote on Jan 17th, 2025 at 4:10pm:
Daves2017 wrote on Jan 17th, 2025 at 2:38pm:
All super is a scam!

If Duddo and dud team cut compulsory super by 3% and the workers receive that 3% via wages I’m all for it!

However I suspect once the employee cuts that 3% it will remain in profits and the employees are actually having their wages go backwards?

Please correct me if I’m wrong?


You are wrong. The market determines your salary. Unless you are on minimum wages, in which case the unions will probably use it to justify an increase, although I doubt they were offering to accept a cut when super came in. They saw it as free money.

The market determines your total salary, including super. For most people, salary will inevitably go up to reflect the lower cost of employing people. It might even reduce unemployment.

freediver wrote on Jan 17th, 2025 at 4:10pm:
Daves2017 wrote on Jan 17th, 2025 at 2:38pm:
All super is a scam!

If Duddo and dud team cut compulsory super by 3% and the workers receive that 3% via wages I’m all for it!

However I suspect once the employee cuts that 3% it will remain in profits and the employees are actually having their wages go backwards?

Please correct me if I’m wrong?


You are wrong. The market determines your salary. Unless you are on minimum wages, in which case the unions will probably use it to justify an increase, although I doubt they were offering to accept a cut when super came in. They saw it as free money.

The market determines your total salary, including super. For most people, salary will inevitably go up to reflect the lower cost of employing people. It might even reduce unemployment.


Productivity.

In 2022, the average labour productivity in OECD countries stood at $67.5 per hour. Ireland and Norway stand out with the highest productivity levels, exceeding $160 per hour, more than double the OECD average.
Denmark, Switzerland, Luxembourg, Belgium, = above $100.

Australia= $79


NZ = $54
Mexico =$24.

https://qery.no/highest-and-lowest-productivity-levels-in-oecd-countries-in-2022...

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freediver
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Re: At Risk Under The Coalition Super Proposal
Reply #13 - Jan 18th, 2025 at 10:26am
 
Are you trying to make a point Frank?
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Re: At Risk Under The Coalition Super Proposal
Reply #14 - Jan 18th, 2025 at 10:41am
 
freediver wrote on Jan 17th, 2025 at 12:11pm:
Quote:
My admin fee at Unisuper is $48 for the financial year, so probably $100 for the whole 12 months. If there are hidden fees they are well hidden.


You probably just have to read the fine print. Also, the financial year is 12 months long.

Quote:
Admittedly, I cannot control particular investments in particular companies but can and do choose between various safe- balanced- growth- high growth - green - cash etc mixes.


This probably costs you even more.

Unisuper was one of the better ones last time I checked though.



Dear FD,
it was inevitable that when someone else is "looking after" your money
that a certain amount of it would disappear.
The Govt too has its greedy eyes on all of it -
always thinking of new ways to get some too.


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